15. Scott Morton on Mistakes to Avoid in Fundraising

With his refreshing, biblical emphasis and extensive experience, it is no surprise that Scott Morton is a trusted voice in the ministry world. In fact, if you're a fundraiser, his first book Funding Your Ministry, may have been required reading.  

Today he joins us to share the ups and downs of his own journey and to coach us in some critical, but avoidable, mistakes. Scott speaks with conviction and a genuine desire to see others put their trust in His provision.

www.Scottmorton.net

*God’s Presence in your Fundraising by Scott Morton

*What the Bible Actually Says About Money by Scott Morton

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Transcript

Unknown: 0:00

I pray for every person listening right now that you would give them grace to know what's the next thing they can do in their funding. And, Lord, may we do our fundraising in a biblical manner. Or we ask that you lay it on the hearts of people to already before we even go to see them, prepare them for our visit and prepare them to be generous. Help us to be wise and kind, and loving. Help us to be good listeners. And we ask it all in Jesus name. Amen.

Heather Winchell: 0:34

Welcome to it's not about the money, a podcast in search of grounded fundraising. I'm Heather, and together with my co host, Andy, we look beyond the Quick Tips and formulas. Join us as we explore the nuance and complexity of ministry, fundraising. If you want to thrive in partner development, not just survive it, this is the place for you. Welcome back, everybody. This is Heather in studio. So Andy is not in with us today. But we've invited back Andrew, who you might remember from our conversation with Steve Shadrach. And Andrew is filling in for Andy. Very excited to do so.

Unknown: 1:11

Yeah, I'm excited as well, Heather, and I love that we're just keeping the names consistent. Just the closest we can get to Andy. Right, Andrew? I love it. I love rate strategy.

Heather Winchell: 1:22

It is it's a great strategy. So Andrew, why don't you tell everybody what we will be diving into today?

Unknown: 1:27

Yeah, I'm really excited for this conversation and to be a part of it. And Heather and I were talking it is very helpful to be taught, you know, best practices and to develop a solid foundation and vision for fundraising as part of ministry and even your own formation. However, it can also be very helpful to just talk specifically about what not to do. Our guest today has decades of experience in personal fundraising, as well as coaching and training others. We're so grateful to get some practical help from his spirit led wisdom and years of on the ground experience. So Heather, would you mind just going ahead and introducing our guests?

Heather Winchell: 2:03

Absolutely. I am so honored to introduce you guys to Scott Morton. You probably recognize that name as he has written several very helpful resources in the fundraising space. But just to give you a little bit more context for our conversation with Scott. So he has worked for 14 years, he worked in leading the navigator, campus and marketplace ministries. He worked with students, business people, missionaries, and in the stateside and overseas context, and for 12 years, he served as the vice president of the navigators, US Development Ministry, I've had the opportunity and privilege to meet Scott in person and he has shown himself to be such a generous man in his time, and and truly His desire to help others. So I'm so excited to bring you guys into a conversation with him. With that I have just one more piece of information that I learned about him that I would love to mention, as we invite him to speak, Scott, your website says that you are an avid bird watcher.

Unknown: 3:04

That's correct. Jesus in Matthew six said to observe the birds did he not? He did in his biblical. We all should be bird watchers. But yes, that's my hobby. I love it.

Heather Winchell: 3:16

Well, that struck me because recently we took our four boys to a natural area and I saw my very first goldfinch. I'd heard of that bird, and I'd never seen one and I saw one. I'm curious whether you have a bird that you enjoy watching.

Unknown: 3:33

I enjoy watching hawks are there to identify sometimes, but I want like to watch them soar and, and I like the Warblers to the little dinky birds that are hard to see and Ukrainian to find them. But yeah, there's about 750 or 800 species in North America and most of us only know Robin Goldfinch and chicken and that's about it. That's, I think it's so fun to watch birds. I've had a chance to go do that with a good friend. And, and actually in that conversation with him. We had a discussion about is it Are you a bird watcher or an ornithologist? Now, Scott, I'm curious to hear. Would you consider yourself a full blown ornithologist or more of the bird watcher? Well, ornithologist, absolutely not. tween birdwatcher. an ornithologist is the term birder and birders prefer to be called birders rather than bird watchers. Okay, birdwatcher does kind of have a little like a creepy tone to it. Yeah. A bird. Yeah, that's yeah, I like that one better a birder. That's, that's great. Well, well, Scott. I'd love to just get started here with just if you wouldn't mind sharing a little of your own story of how you entered into support based ministry. Well, thank you, and welcome, everyone. I'm delighted to be here today and thank you very much. My fundraising journey began One day I took my boss at the newspaper out to lunch, to tell him that I was going to quit my job and go into full time. Ministry course every Christian is already full time, but he knew what I meant. So I took him to loams weener bar in Iowa City. Now my boss, Carl is a no nonsense newspaperman. And I was doing well at my job. He liked what I did, and I enjoyed him too. And so as long as I told him, I'd be quitting my job, to go into ministry full time with the navigators. He just looked at me, history. Students at the University were coming to Christ, and I needed more time for Bible study, and so on with Carl, I'm going to go into ministry. He said, What about the money? Are you going to provide for yourself? I said, Carl, not to worry, God will provide. Now I knew that was probably the right answer. But I didn't have a clue as to how that was all going to work out. Now, I had sent a letter a few months before to people on our mailing list such as we had in those days, asking them all to pray about supporting our ministry. And they may still be praying for all I know, because not one person gave, nothing came in. And many navigators in those days were single, and they could live on campus or with a bunch of students or something and get by a little, but I was married and had two kids. So something had to give. So I did quit. And the Altos game, threw me a going away party. And they presented me with a huge plaque in the shape of a penny. And on the penny, it said, In God, we trust all others, strictly cash. And so it began. I didn't know what to do. But my fundraising strategy was basically do the ministry, and the money will come in. That's what some of my friends told me just be faithful to ministry, because where he guides he provides, and God's will done in God's way never lacks God's supply. And I believe that and I was faithful doing the ministry and the money wasn't coming in. Unfortunately, I my wife, Alma does not live in the state of denial. And so she came in one day and said, Okay, we've very nicely, very gracious lady, she said, we used up her savings. Are you going to support this family? Or not? Well, of course, I was going to support this family, but I didn't know what to do. So I asked advice of other people, once it's still Christian books. That's the key. So lots of Christian books. Most of the people I knew were not Christians. I mean, I was with a newspaper, and I hung out with all kinds of clients, and I didn't know their, their their Christian basis or not. Another said, just trust the Lord. And some people promised to give and then never gave. It was frustrating. So finally, I turned to the Bible. And I got my Bible, I looked in the concordance under the word fundraising. And what do you think I found? Nothing. But I knew the Bible had to have some answers. So I began ransack in the Bible just at random trying to find verses on money, or fundraising or support or something. And God was faithful. I did find one. The first one I found was Numbers, chapter 18, verse 21, numbers 1821. And I'll just read the part that stood out to me. So I'm searching around how do I get funded for ministry? And it says to the sons of Levi, Behold, I have given all the ties in Israel in return for their service, and the pronoun I just jumped out at me, don't ever forget, I have been looking horizontally at people rather than vertically for heaven. So I thought, well, I need to change my, my focus for one thing. So that was where it started, I began to look toward God more than toward people. Then a friend of mine, I was complaining to him about our funding, and it was bad and why I went a while. And he said, Well, Scott, do you pray about it? You pray about it every day. Is a well, I don't pray about it every day. He said, If I were you, I think I pray about it every day. And shortly after that, I found Matthew chapter six, verse 11, the Lord's Prayer, where it says in verse 11, Give us this day, our daily bread. And so I wrote in my journal, why my budget and I wrote down the exact number out of my head to pray every day God would you supply this monthly amount? Now, I wish I could say the things were fine after that. But I did find more and more scriptures, about 20 or 25 scripts that related directly to fundraising. And so I was encouraged by that. And I realized it was not wrong to invite people to give because I was under guilt, but Oh, you just kept sending about money. Don't do that at all. And so I didn't want to do anything. And so my first fundraising appeal, I went to the home of two elderly widow ladies from our church back in Ames. And I noticed that the sofa was worn the carpet was worn the door was off the hinges screen door, and I thought, these poor ladies are poor, I can't ask them. So I chickened out. I even though they were very friendly and very positive, I chickened out. And that happened several times. Alright, pray, Lord, let them bring up the subject of money. And they never brought it up. So my first six or eight appeals went for nowhere. And finally, one farmer said, in eastern Iowa, I believe I'd like to support you. I said you would, really. So that's how it began. But I had this Bible study of about 20 verses. And that was what, what started things. So after that, things began to change. And but it was because of Elmas question. Elvis question, got me going. And then it was the Bible that brought me the rest away. So because of the Bible, and Elmo, I am here today. So that's how it began, it was a pretty ugly beginning. But that was how I got into fundraising. It wasn't because I planned on being a fundraiser. In fact, if if your kids or family members said I, when I grew up, I want to be a fundraiser, you would probably try to talk them out of it when you're that's just the way the culture is. So yeah, that's how it began.

Heather Winchell: 11:30

Thank you so much for sharing that. And I just can't help but be so grateful. Because when I was fundraising for my overseas ministry, I avoided a lot of the, I guess, initial disappointment that maybe you experienced, because I actually had a phenomenal resource guiding me. And you might guess that that resource was funding your ministry by Scott Morton. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Very well, I hope. Yeah. So I'm, you know, as I hear you kind of relay, the different, I guess the way the Lord formed in you your vision of fundraising. And knowing that, as you learn from that, you took that and then you wrote this book, I just can't help it being so grateful for the ways that it did help me orient in looking to God for His provision in practically walking in obedience through different things that he's told us in His Word. So thank you, formally for your help. And from letting me learn from your experiences. I am curious, as we get started, what led you to write this book funding your ministry?

Unknown: 12:37

I didn't intend to write write the book, but it came out of my seminars, because shortly after I did that Bible study that one page Bible study, I was asked to talk around the country to other navigator, staff, and organizations. And so the book came out of the seminar. And the seminar gradually expanded and expanded, expanded to where my was suggested that I write a book on it, because it was just a seminar in print. But the book had in it a couple things that are unique. And one was questions of conscience. We all have questions of conscience about many topics, especially about money. So mine were Is it okay to ask somebody to support? And then is it okay to suggest they give a certain amount? What about that? And what about asking non believers or people we think are non believers? How do we know for sure? And then what about asking people who are not as well off as you are? Because some of your giving partners may not have as high an income as you do? Can you only ask the higher? So I had all these conscience questions embedded in my mind swirling around? So I had to get that out. And that's what the first book has a couple chapters on that. And then attitudes, I realized that fundraising is more than just a few phrases, few words or a few nuances. How, what's your attitude like? And so there's a whole section in the book on attitudes about fundraising, and if we have the attitudes, right, and the questions of counsel, questions of conscience answered, then I think we can work on technique and our techniques, there are skills because as I mentioned, even though I had my my attitude, right on the Bible, my skills were terrible. I didn't know what to say when I was asked a question I didn't know how to ask. And I kind of blurted it out badly sometimes. And then I hinted sometimes, this economy sure is tough on us missionaries and stuff like that. It's terrible. So skills are also important. So that's why I wrote the book. It was just an outgrowth of my by seminars. And I was glad to do it. I was glad to see that people actually liked it.

Heather Winchell: 14:45

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. I did. Yeah. Okay. So I know that you've recently published a variety of other books as well. And I have one that actually you so generously gave me God's presence in your fundraising. I would love to know you know, After this time, what led you to write that book and then also, another book that recently came out what the Bible actually says about money, which I've had a little time to get into, and it is gold, I encourage everybody to get a copy. It is so so good. But I would just be curious what led to writing those at this time?

Unknown: 15:19

Well, thank you for asking. Yeah. Let's talk first about what the Bible actually says about money. This is not a book for missionaries, specifically, but this is for all Christians. Because depending on who you talk to, people say there's 600 verses on money in the Bible, and some say there's over 1000, and so on, it's a little bit subjective, but I just took 40 of those verses on money. You know, we're not, we're not going to learn all 600 verses online. But let's start with, I started with 31 a day. So let's just see what the Bible says about money on 30. And taking out all the assumptions and emotions that we bring into it. Let's just see what the Bible says. So for example, one chapter on what did Jesus say about tithing? why you'd be surprised to learn Jesus didn't necessarily recommend or affirm tithing. A lot of people wonder about, is it okay to save, especially for missionaries? Because it's other people's money? Is it okay to save, so we've been talking about saving. So this is things that are every Christian should learn, because money is a hidden area of discipleship. When I was being crippled, I don't remember anybody sitting down and saying, Scott, let's talk about money. It's kind of an Off Limits subject. And I found that to be the case in almost every culture. So this book is about what the Bible actually says, it doesn't draw conclusions for you, or tell you what to do, or how much to give or how much to save. It's not a handbook like that. But it's a book to get your head right about what the Bible says. And then the next book, God's presence in your fundraising. Fundraising can be a tense, stressful time for a lot of people, especially if they make appeals and the money doesn't come in. And so they're tempted to quit or not want to keep going. So this book is an attempt. It's got 4040 passages, 14 days of being with the Lord, just like Moses on Mount Sinai. So 40 days, one verse a day on what the Bible says about fundraising, God's presence in your fundraising, because it's easy to lose track of the Lord. We're doing a busy thing. Like fundraise. Yeah, so that's, that's basically why I wrote both those books.

Heather Winchell: 17:32

That's excellent. Yeah. And like I said, I've really enjoyed, enjoyed reading them.

Unknown: 17:39

Now, Scott, I even just talking to you this short amount of time, it's obvious that you go straight to the Bible for and straight to scripture for fundraising and conversations on money. And that's what you're drawing from. And I know you already shared one story about as you started your fundraising, your first fundraising journey, about how scripture met you in that way, and guided you. But I'd be curious to hear and maybe even whether that was a time when you had to go back into fundraising or continue fundraising after a slump, or or something like that, where were scripture met you and in a timely and practical way where it guided you through one of those seasons? Yeah, as scripture has guided me all the way because I just feel like we can adopt the world's methods on fundraising, although some of the principles are the world's methods on fundraising. And some of the biblical principles are identical. There's not a problem there. But I don't want to just jump to best practices automatically, even though they may be effective. My person I worked for when I first came up to Colorado Springs was Ron Sargent, one of the Navigator pioneers. And he said, Just because a fundraising tactic works, doesn't make it right. Yeah, kept in mind. There's a lot of things that are going on in even Christian fundraising today that I think we raise our eyebrow at sometimes. And we need to make sure that we're biblically grounded. So in the early days, I worked on our funding, and I had my Bible study and I had my questions of conscience answered, and so I was just had my head down was going but one of the things that struck me a lot was Luke 8123. Because I always wondered, How did Jesus get funded? discovered a lot of people don't know this. Did he have a job? Did he have an inheritance he lived off. Did he have savings from his carpentry and stonemason work are always Jesus funded and Luke 8123 gives us the answer. Just part of it here. He was going about from village to village preaching and the 12 are with him and also some women a bit scandalous, even for that day. Also, some women who had been hailed as evil spirits and sicknesses. Mary who was called Magdalene, and when seven demons had gone out, and Joanne To the wife of Chuza, Herod's steward, and Susanna, and many others, who are contributing to their support out of their private means when Jesus was supported by a group of women. Now there might have been men involved with the two but it doesn't say, but at least three of these women are named Chuza. Suzanna Joanna, so Joanna, the wife of Chuza, Herod's steward. So this shows that God has a sense of humor, because here, here at Stewart Chuza is earning money which his wife Joanna is now giving to the Messiah, and disciples, who are Herons, opponents. So I think that shows that God has a sense of humor, when it comes to fundraising, says many others will how many others? Well, if we go to Matthew chapter 27, at the foot of the cross, we see there are two or three other women named. And then in Luke, there's one morning. And so we have, we can make a list of maybe six or seven women who were funders of Jesus. And these women are just one off givers and acts 114, we say that we see it see that when the disciples were alone, praying, because of fear of the Jews, they along with the women, x one a women were still there, the donors were still there. And who were the first people to see Jesus after He was resurrected from the dead, the donors. So Jesus was not funded by an outside slush fund, he did not have a regular job that we know. He was funded by faithful people who gave for at least three years, and perhaps longer. So that was a verse has touched me deeply. I like this model that Jesus had, this is a reproducible model of gathering a few people about who will travel with you and fund you. The second really strike me out of it is Romans 1520, to 24. And I don't know if you studied that much. But this this gives a nice outline here, of I call it the four P's of Paul. So Romans 1520. Thus I aspired to preach the gospel, not what Christ was already meant named. So here's Paul's passion, or Paul's purpose, perhaps, to preach where Christ is not named. Notice it's only seven words. You know, I can get my job or my vision down to about two paragraphs, and I think I'm doing good, but we need to be careful with that. Let's get our passion if you can't say it in a sentence. That makes sense. What are we doing? So I like this, here's Paul's passion. And then we have in verse 22, as it is written, they who had news no news of him shall see, and they who have not heard shall understand. That's a quote from the book of Isaiah, chapter 52, just before the servant song and Isaiah 53. So here's Paul's promise. He's got he leans on a promise from the Old Testament that they who are not heard John understand. So Paul's passion, Paul's promise. And then in verse 24, whenever I go to Spain, he was on his way to Spain, I hope to see you in passing and to be helped on my way they're by you. So the word here help them my way is a Greek word for pimple. And I don't know if our listeners know that PR, O P, E, M, P, O, pro pimple. It's used eight times in the New Testament. And every time it means practical assistance. So when when Paul left deficits, they all came down to the beach, and they probe him pulled him off. So it means to send some money along with some provision, or even send a traveler along with to help them on their way. So it means helping someone on their way. It's a financial word. So Paul's passion, false promise, and now Paul's pro pimple or peel. And then last we have when I had first enjoyed your company for a while, first 24. Here's Paul's personal relationships. He was in no hurry to get out of Rome and get on to Spain, he took time with his giving partners. That's something we missionaries need to do and something I needed to learn because I was Go, go go and I want just get the money and go, but I realized I need to spend time because spending time with our getting partners is also ministry, and they need ministry and we need them to minister to us as well. So I like this passage, Romans 1520 to 24, Paul's four P's. Passion, promise, pimple and personal relationships. That made a big difference in how I guided when I got discouraged. And when I was encouraged. I knew what to do.

Heather Winchell: 24:47

Yeah, and no doubt you know, as you've had opportunity in your different positions and as a coach. That's no doubt been part of the way that you've encouraged others as you've seen them along in their own support based ministry.

Unknown: 25:00

Yeah, I think as you're coaching others, you can you can just say what school were one of these four P's because maybe they've got their passion nailed down, but they don't have a promise. So they don't have confidence. Or maybe they've got passion promise, but they don't know how to ask for me, neglecting their donors. So yeah, these four Ps can be an outline for how we do mentoring.

Heather Winchell: 25:19

Yeah, absolutely. I know that initially, when you were telling us the story of how you entered into support based ministry, you mentioned quite a few mistakes that you made at that time. We are very excited to talk with you very specifically today about some common mistakes to avoid in your fundraising. I'm curious if there are any other mistakes you made, that you didn't previously mentioned that you would want to share as we kind of get going in that discussion?

Unknown: 25:47

Yeah, thank you. Good question. We could do another podcast on just that. So here's here's five. And maybe I'll add a sixth one, we have time. But these are mistakes I've made. And I've seen other missionaries make missionaries for America, but also missionaries in other parts of the world. Americans make these mistakes in their own culture. So they're pretty common. So number one is hinting instinct. You know, what I mean by that is, instead of asking directly, I hint, or we say beat around the bush. I have a friend, a missionary friend, I was with him. And I was going to help them in his fundraising and, and he had a very good ministry with businessmen. And these businessmen were pretty well connected. They had money, but he was always the missionary was always below support. And he talked about money all the time. I couldn't figure out what was going wrong, because I met some of the guys they liked him. He was a extremely likable person winsome and had a good minister. He was discipling. Businessman. And finally, I asked him, you talk about money all the time. But do you ever ask anyone face to face this question? Would you pray about supporting my ministry? They want 100 to $200 a month? Silence? No, he'd never asked that question. And so just being visible, just being around dental donors and talking about money. That's not fundraising. That's fellowship or something. But it's not fundraising. It's good. But it's not fundraising. So we have to have to learn it in team and just visibility is not fundraising. Last week, a friend said he was thinking of asking someone to join the team, and he went over to see them. And the lady said, the married couple of ways said before you start she said, I want to ask you a question. If we offended you or something. He said, No, you haven't offended me. So well. Why do you think that I've offended you? And she said, Well, you never asked us for support. We thought you were mad. So we need to be a little more direct. And I think even an indirect cultures in Asia, we still need to think about being direct, but in an Asian kind of way. But just hanging around with believers, is not going to do it.

Heather Winchell: 28:14

Scott, I'm really curious, in your experiences with people, maybe maybe with the coaching hat on, would you say that people tend to hint more because of an underlying question of conscience? Or is it more like a heart, a heart issue and maybe like a feeling of fear? What do you what do you think is behind the hinting versus asking?

Unknown: 28:38

A good question, I can speak for myself, and then I can speak for what others have told me, but I think primarily it's fear. I don't want to offend. I don't want to have them think badly of me or think badly of Christ. Yeah, I get it. I've been through all that. But in the end, we we don't serve people by being vague. In evangelism, we we certainly ask people at the right time, will you pray about receiving Will you pray about receiving Christ? And so we don't just be vague in that way as well. But hinting is just our way of seeing trying to be not offensive, but in a way it denigrates the donor because we don't think they can take it to the we don't think they can handle it. Of course they can handle it. You're not going to be Yeah, can we offend people? Yeah, I've offended people sometimes by being too aggressive, but I don't know maybe twice out of a word 1000 appeals maybe. And that was family. Yeah, be careful with family family is a little different ballgame because they know you in different ways. And they're going to talk about you at the family reunion. So

Heather Winchell: 29:52

yeah, sound dynamic for sure.

Unknown: 29:55

Yep. Okay, the second mistake that I've made and I see others make is a small mailing list. To ask missionaries how many people on your mailing list and often they say, Oh 35 or 60, or 80, or 100? And I say think bigger. Think that well, why do you need a large business? Well, number one, because you don't know who's gonna give and who's not. If we keep our mailing list small, what we're saying is, I think that the out of the 60 people on my on my list, these 60, people are going to be the ones who are going to support me to full budget for the rest of my life, or the rest of my term. You don't know that. Because even if all 60 Give, that might not be enough. Secondly, let's give everybody an opportunity. Having a large mailing list is not only about fundraising, it is about fundraising, but it's also about the gospel. So let's put a lot of people on our mailing list because as you write your letters and tell your stories of gospel advance that's gonna touch them. I put my seventh grade English teacher on my mailing list. She's 475 years old. And she likes my letter. She'd write me back. Oh, thank you for the letter. So I went to see her in Florida a few years ago. And she and her husband, they were very gracious. And I said, No, do you remember? They used to give me assignments in writing? Yes. I said, Well, I've got an assignment for you. Will you accept an assignment for me now? Oh, yeah. So I had the bridge diagram of the Christ on one side and or the Oban on one side and God on the other Christ in between? dread that bitch I get Okay. Here's your assignment. Look at your Bible and fill in the verses on these 12 verses for this bridge assignment? Will you do that? Oh, yes, I'll do that. So your mailing list is simply an excuse to get the gospel to people. Yes, we'll give we want them to give but but not also, enlarge your mailing list. It's not just a fundraising vehicle. Now Philippians 410 is a passage in this regard. It says, Paul is writing the Philippians and actually appreciating their their support. And he says in verse 10, I rejoice in the Lord greatly that now at last, you have revived your concern for me, indeed, you were concerned before but you lacked opportunity. So we Americans like formulas. So here's the formula, C plus O equal funding, concern, plus opportunity, funding, that we write our letters, and we try to raise people's concern, we tell stories, we draw their emotions because we need to, we tell stories about the gospel. And that raises their concern, but then we need to give them an opportunity. So every now and then we say, Will you pray about joining our team, either face to face, or at the end of the year, perhaps in an appeal letter? So let's add a lot of people to the mailing list. Don't ask the question, who will give as the question who needs to hear my gospel story? I love that reframe. Scott. That's such a good point. I'm in the middle of coaching several funders themselves. And I think that's such a great point to hit on. Some some of the of the people I've been coaching, have 300 names immediately ready to go and say, Hey, let's let's get going. And I I've had one gal who I've been working with who's kind of around the 60 to 65 names, and I kind of came back and asked her, hey, you know what's going on? I do you know, more people like I bet you have, if you go on Facebook, you can look at 400 facebook names, right? And that was her her exact quote to me was, well, these are the people I think that might give, right? And trying to widen that perspective of, hey, what can God do, though? You know, let's not limit what God is going to be doing through these people. And in your ministry, right. And I think that's such a good point. You know, another thing people say, Where do I find the names? And one woman, young missionary was weeping because she couldn't think of more than 60 names. And so her coach said, how many names do you have on Facebook and Instagram? She said, only 700. Boohoo. Wait a minute, she said, now, we're not gonna put all 700 Instagram names on our mailing list. Out of those seven, are there 200 of those? Yeah. So that's the place to start looking. Great.

Heather Winchell: 34:25

Yeah, that's very practical and good. Yeah, thanks. Alright, so number three,

Unknown: 34:31

number three, failure to pray over your budget, and your top 25 I mentioned before, there's a friend who challenged me to pray every day. And so in my journal, I have my my budget written out the the number, pray about it, that's my daily bread, but also the top 25 So on my website, Scott morton.net, you can find a worksheet called the top 25 And this is where you list 25 people you think, want to hear your story and the next one 30 to 60 days. So named by name. Pray over those people before you call him before you text him before you try to get together, pray over them and see what happens. I found and others have told me too, that they say, Scott, we were just talking about you last week. It's funny you should call today. That's happened several times. And other missionaries have had the same thing. So we pray about name by name of people, we're going to go see, we need to realize that God goes before us in fundraising. In one of our first seminars in Detroit, years ago, a missionary came with his wife and young babies, and they were getting a training. And then in those days, we would go out in the evening, and they'd make appointments, and they go out and actually talk to somebody that evening, because it was their hometown. So they they call this, this couple, and went to their home. And they were at pulled up the address, and they were getting out the car, getting the baby seat out and so on. And while they're getting out of the car with the baby, and everything, the owner of the house was looking at the picture window, looking at them, and then came out into the street and said, May I help you? That oh, we're here to see so and so. So this is the wrong address. Oh, though, they start putting the baby back in. They got he said, Wait a minute, what were you going to talk to this couple about anyway, come on in to invite him into his house, this complete stranger, and they told him about their ministry, and he became a faithful monthly partner. It was all a mistake. Now God works all these things out. So let's realize that God goes before us on our top 25 list. And he if we don't think God goes before us, then I'm not sure we should go. Receding work of God or prevenient. Grace. So let's pray over our top 25 Not just our budget. And I confess I've neglected that in the past. Okay, number four failure, just say thank you one by one. And I like to call it individualize your thinking. Maybe you've had this experience, I think almost everybody I've talked to has had this experience where they sign up to support a missionary monthly or quarterly. And they never hear from them personally. They might have quarterly newsletter or a year end appeal or something but never so Elman. I did this for three years with with someone we knew well, he knew us well. But we got his newsletters, but no personal recognition of our giving. Another friend who wrote in said, I supported this missionary for 12 years. And I got his newsletters three or four times a year, but I never once had him connect with me on a personal basis. That leads to bitterness and resentment. It also may show the entitlement mentality on the part of the missionary. So why don't we say thank you? Why don't we say thank you one by one. Now it's good to send newsletters to say thank you and every letter good. It's good to send just personal notes, thank you. But it's also good to buy text by phone and best face to face, go after people and thank them. Even Jesus model this in John nine you remember the healing of the blind man healed. And then the Pharisees and others said he didn't really heal you. And so we'll go talk to my parents and they talked to his parents. And they said, Ask him, he's of age and so on. They wouldn't believe him. So Jesus said, Jesus heard about this. And John 935 says Jesus, finding him finding Him Jesus went after him and said, Do you believe in the name of the Son of Man? So Jesus did a little follow up here. He sought him out personally, because there was a problem. So I think that's our model. Let's individualize our thanks. Number five. Failure to follow up. A good friend of mine, good good guy, good missionary in the Philippines, made came home on furlough and made 52 face to face appeals in Texas. That's where he came from. And he'd been in a church there and people loved him there. 52 face to face appeals in about a little over a month. He worked hard. Wow. But he said only six of those pledge support. said what's going on because our average around the world if you do face to face is at least 50% in most most every country. And only six out of 52 I said what went wrong said I don't know what that said. Did you leave a pledge card? Yes. Did you ask? Yes. He did everything right. And then I said, Did you follow up with a phone call about a week afterwards? Oh, no. Was I supposed to do that? Yeah, yeah. So follow up. And the best way to do this is when you're with them on the call and you give them the pledge card and say Now may I call you in a week's time and see how the Lord is leading and if you have any other questions, stop. silence So It's good to even set up the you're gonna call them before you leave that appointment, because then they're expected. Now in second Corinthians chapter eight, the apostle Paul did a little follow up itself because the Corinthians had pledged for the project for Jerusalem that Paul had told him a year before, but no money had come in. So Paul was coming back and sending Titus even to check up on them. verses of chapter eight, Paul said, but now finish doing it. So Paul was checking back with them strongly to encourage them to finish what they had started to do. So yeah, let's go back, let's follow up on people and help them to be faithful. And even if some donors lapse, if they literally don't, or lapses, three months, you got to get back to it right away. And I would recommend a phone call. And I like this, you're usually so very faithful in your giving. And but I noticed the last three months, your gift does not come into our account. I wonder Is everything okay?

Heather Winchell: 41:02

Follow up is such an important piece. And actually that, you know, when I was thinking about the mistakes that I made, in my own fundraising, the failure to follow up was one of the biggest and actually, it really came to bear on me and my team, because, you know, when I went overseas, I, through the generosity of others, had full support pledged and then I launched, and I kind of never looked back. But because I hadn't followed up with one of the donors that actually was, was giving a very generous gift monthly, they on their end, they just forgot to set it up or something happened with the card they had used or something like that. But you know, four or five months later, when the, the financial advisor from the group that I was with, emailed and said, Hey, we've got a shortfall. And you know, of course, there's many layers of mistakes on my part, I should have been much more dialed into what was happening, but But I realized, oh, man, that that family that had pledged this generous gift, like I never followed up to make sure that both on the receiving end that that it was being received each month, and I never followed up with them to make sure that they knew what to do in the event that something needed to change. So that was a big mistake that I made that had consequence. I'm curious, Andrew, if any of these apply to your, the mistakes you made in your own industry?

Unknown: 42:17

Yeah, I think indirectly in some of them. I was thinking back to my fundraising journey. And that started after after finishing college and joining the campus ministry I was involved with. And I remember, and I think probably what relates closest to is the hinting about money and meeting about funds. And really what's behind that, Scott, what you mentioned is fear, right? I'm afraid to actually go all the way and ask and, and not be direct about it. And I think I was so afraid that I decided the best thing for me to do to start my support raising journey was to take a two week road trip with my friends and completely forget about it. And going on the road trip and kind of leaving it all leave my problems on the road, you know, and come back and deal with it at the end. And so I remember coming back from that and with this feeling of oh man, I better I better be on my game now because I've I've wasted two weeks out of fear right of trying to just avoid it in general. And so I think that comes back to the the not willing to go full all the way are not willing to actually engage in the process fully.

Heather Winchell: 43:27

Yeah.

Unknown: 43:28

So you employed a tactic that even the great man David employed or that I had wings like a dove i could fly with. That's right. That's right. Well, no alternative. Andrew is a two week road trip. Yep. I don't think it's gonna make any books. I'll say that. Let me give you let me give you one more mistake I made here and this one is the failure to listen. To listen, talking too much. Oh, I wish I could have my words back sometimes knocked on and sometimes when we get nervous. We talk. Do we know ourselves well enough to know what what habits you go to when you're nervous. Some people clam up. A lot of people just keep talking, talking talking. I was with a Christian leader one time who had a fundraising goal, the major donor spoke he dominated the conversation like 80 or 85% of the time. It was all good stuff. He said it was all inspirational, but the donors didn't get to talk. So I like to see me talking 40% Then talking 60% Or half and a half, at least. But that's sometimes a challenge when the person you're with isn't a big talker. But let's learn to ask questions and let's learn to draw them out. It's more important to be interested than interesting. So let's throw them out and let them share. James 119 Let every man be quick to hear, slow to speak. So that's another error I made and Wish I could have those words back.

Heather Winchell: 45:02

That is such good counsel and wisdom. So you know, as we wrap up this episode, this has been so helpful. We're just so grateful for your time knowing that this is going out to listeners, both here in the States and even worldwide, from potentially a variety of backgrounds, what encouragement would you want to provide, as they persevere in the peaks and valleys of support based ministry?

Unknown: 45:29

Yeah, let's face it, there's going to be ups and downs in our fundraising journey, like Andrew just alluded to, but sometimes things go well, and sometimes you get discouraged and just want to stop altogether. And sometimes we even get mad at our donors, we get mad at God, we get mad at the ministry, or why do I have to do this. And I find them that a pep talk doesn't help me. Or giving a talk to others, it's gone, get back in there, come on, you can do this doesn't help much. But Hebrews 416 is a big deal. Hebrews 416. Therefore, let us start well, 15, for we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses. But one who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. Therefore, therefore, let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. A young missionary came onto our team and very brilliant, gifted, young guy likable. But he was in tears almost after a few months of fundraising. And he said, I can't imagine doing this for the next 10 years. And then he said, I can't imagine doing this for the next 10 weeks. And I said, you don't have to imagine doing it for the next 10 weeks. Let's try the next 10 minutes. That's all you need. So grace to help in time of need. So we come to a throne of grace, not a throne of hard work. Yeah, fundraising is hard work. But we don't come back to work harder. Just work harder, not the answer, we come to a throne of grace. So let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace. So we receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Now, what is grace? Well, the theological definition is G are a see God's riches at Christ's expense. Great. I like it. But let's take it a little further. What about grace and fundraising? Well, we know that we're already saved by faith. And now we're gonna get fully funded by faith. So I think of grace is supernatural enablement to help you do what must be done, whether you feel like it or not, supernatural enablement to do what must be done, whether you feel like it or not. I confess there's times I don't feel like making another phone call writing another letter going on another appointment, trying to find another name, I don't want to do that. So I say Lord, little discouraged today, you know, that little discourage today. But I'm gonna give it 30 minutes. And then I'm stopping. Would you give me grace for 30 minutes, as I dial the phone. So every time I've done that, I ended up enjoying it, and I'm on the phone for more than 30 minutes and setting up not one appointment, but four or five. So let's, let's take it easy on ourselves. You don't have to think about the next 10 years of fundraising. Just ask God for grace for the next 10 minutes.

Heather Winchell: 48:36

Yeah, and it's amazing how grounding and helpful it can be to just invite God into it, you know, because what you're doing in asking for grace is basically saying, Lord, like, come into this, right. And I that reminds me just, you know, this resource, you've provided God's presence in your fundraising like that. That is so much of the power and the ability to to move forward and grace is just relying on and banking on you know, God's presence in that moment. God's What did you say the preceding work of God going before you? That's I think that's the least.

Unknown: 49:09

Yeah, prevented prevenient grace, the theologians say,

Heather Winchell: 49:13

yeah, yeah. Which actually, I think is one of the chapters in the God's presence book. But yeah, so guys, if you have enjoyed this conversation, which I'm, I'm positive you have, I have enjoyed it so much. I just want to point out again, that Scott has a variety of resources, both in books, which we will link in the show notes, but also on his websites got borton.net There are videos that you can watch.

Unknown: 49:36

There's about 153 minute videos, and we just launched last week, two minute videos. That's because my attention span is going down. No, it's two minute videos, with a cartoon by Wayne State gallery as the cartoons in that first book. So we're doing a cartoon by state scale and a two minute tip along with it. We're gonna have 30 of those put out at the net Here's one every two weeks. So those are just starting right now. And then there's worksheets like that top 25. The up till now report. There's Bible studies. And we're now in language studies in French that you can get these studies in French. And especially. So anyway. Yeah, Scott Morton dotnet. I feel like I'm trying to sell things here. But these are resources that I think will be of help to you. And if you hit a snag, send me an email.

Heather Winchell: 50:25

Yeah, very, very helpful. And actually, before we started recording, Scott, let us know that one of his books was just translated into Arabic, which is so cool. Yeah. All right. Well, guys, that brings us to the end of our episode. And you know, we have a standard question we ask everybody. And since Andrew has never had the opportunity to ask him before, I'm going to let him do the honors? Yes. And

Unknown: 50:48

it is not a bird question, Scott. So don't worry there. But no, Scott. So you have this is just right off the top of your head, you have$10,000 that you have to give away today, you have five seconds to decide who or what do you give it to? Easy to answer that I would give it to the fundraising coaches are going to be teaching a biblical fundraising school in America or anyplace in Africa, Asia, Latin America, Europe, I would give it to that school to help the students arrive. Because sometimes the local missionaries don't have any money, they can't even travel to the capital city to have a school. Let's fund them to get there. And then let's find the teachers to get there. So we can have this school and then have people go home with money in their pocket. I'd also like to use that money at the school to give bonus prizes for people that add the most names, their mailing list. Those who get the most appointments, just make it a little fun. Yeah, rewards for they're coming.

Heather Winchell: 51:49

Yeah, that is really great. I love that.

Unknown: 51:51

It's beautiful. It's beautiful. Scott, thank

Heather Winchell: 51:53

you again, so much for your time, would you pray for us?

Unknown: 51:57

I'd be delighted to Let's pray together. Father, here we are. We're listening in on this from around the world. And we join our hearts now as one and we know that our requests in our appeals and our heart will go to the throne of grace, where we can find grace to help in time of need. I pray for every person listening right now that you would give them grace to know what's the next thing they can do in their funding. And, Lord, may we do our fundraising in a biblical manner? Whether we ask that you lay it on the hearts of people to already before we even go to see them? prepare them for our visit and prepare them to be generous. Help us be wise and kind and loving. Help us to be good listeners. And we ask it all in Jesus name. Amen.

Heather Winchell: 52:43

Amen and thank you thanks guys. Thank you

Andy Brennan: 52:52

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