It's Not About the Money: In Search of Grounded Fundraising

30.5 RECAP with Danielle Nelson

• Heather Winchell and Andy Brennan • Season 3 • Episode 30

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In this episode of "It's Not About the Money," Heather and Andy are joined by Danielle Nelson, a seasoned project manager with extensive experience in mobilizing and coaching people in support-based work. Together, they recap the enlightening conversation with Bryn and Christine, who shared their unique perspectives on short-term fundraising from their respective stages in life—one in college and the other established in her career.

Danielle highlights the transformative power of the gospel in fundraising, emphasizing that it's not just about the money but about the impact on both the fundraiser and the donor. The discussion delves into the importance of storytelling, the contagious nature of anxiety, and the necessity of personal, one-on-one conversations in successful fundraising. They also explore practical tips for using technology, the significance of maintaining dignity in storytelling, and the benefits of starting the fundraising process early to build anticipation and engagement.

This episode is packed with insights and encouragement for both new and seasoned fundraisers, reminding listeners that while fundraising can be challenging, it is also a sanctifying process that aligns with God's provision and purpose.

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>> Heather:

Welcome to it's not about the money, a podcast in search of grounded fundraising. I'm Heather and together with my co host Andy, we look beyond the quick tips and formulas. Join us as we explore the nuance and complexity of ministry fundraising. If you want to thrive in partner development, not just survive it, this is the place for you.

>> Andy:

Okay. Welcome back to the show, everyone. Looking forward to recapping the episode from Bryn and Christine and our guest co host, Sarah. today we have with us Danielle and Heather. Would you do the honors of introducing her to us?

>> Heather:

Sure, I'd love to do that, Andy. And I am also looking forward to recapping this conversation since I wasn't able to be part of the original.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

So joining us today is Danielle Nelson, and she is coming to us with experience in not only mobilizing and coaching people in, short term programs, but also having lived and worked in support based work herself for many years. She currently works in project management and spends her day in sales and marketing and everything in between. And she has graciously agreed to come on and share her years of experience with us today. So thank you, Danielle.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Thanks for having me. I'm really excited to be here and.

>> Andy:

Ah, we've been trying to get her on for, you said like a year.

>> Heather:

Yep.

>> Andy:

Yeah. So this has been a long time coming. Thank you for making it work.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Of course. I'm happy to be here.

>> Heather:

Okay, so, as is customary for our recaps, we're going to start with what stood out.

>> Danielle Nelson:

So, yeah, I was, able to listen to the episode and really enjoyed getting to hear the two different perspectives from someone, who is coming from the college age group, and then also someone who's coming from maybe more established in their career and how those two perspectives can be really different for fundraising. But one of the things that really stood out to me that I think both gals hit on in their own way, is that fundraising is about the gospel, and the gospel is transformative, and the gospel is transformative for everyone that it touches. And so that's true for both the fundraiser and for the donor. And that in the act of talking about what you're going to be going to do when you're going to do missions based work, which is, again, the gospel, which is transformative in the lives of the people you're going to touch, as, ah, you're sharing those stories about what you plan to do or what you have already done, that's an opportunity for Christ to touch the people that you're speaking to and that is an amazing opportunity in and of itself. Like, they both talked about the. The importance of story, and that stuck out to me hugely.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think it was really cool to hear just from the two different perspectives of having both. They both have gone, but how they were communicating with donors and how that was received, I was really touched by that.

>> Heather:

yeah, I would agree, and I'm really glad that you drew that out. Just the importance of how fundraising does affect everyone. The person asking, the person being asked. And it reminds me of an upcoming conversation that we have with Callie Davis of SRS and via generosity, where she just talks about even when the answer is no, it's impactful. Right. Because what she said, and I guess spoiler for the listener, because you won't have heard this conversation yet, but what she said was their no means it's a yes to something else, and it's giving them an opportunity to think about what would my yes be, too. And so I think it is transformative, and I think it is, yeah. A beautiful thing that actually touches so many people.

>> Andy:

So fundraising is really more than meets the eye.

>> Heather:

Absolutely, it is. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

So much more. So much more.

>> Heather:

And I think Bryn even articulated that at some point, she just. She realized that it's not about me. It's not about what the money is doing for me. It's what the Lord is doing to work through in the end, the trip.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

You know?

>> Andy:

Absolutely.

>> Heather:

Yeah. I think just as we say it's not about the money, we could also say it's not about you. It's, not only about you.

>> Andy:

Absolutely. Yeah. You have to keep reorienting. You gotta keep shifting the focus back to the gospel. I mean, and that's. That's informative. Not just for fundraising, but for every minute of every day.

>> Heather:

Yeah, yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It reminds me of the miracle of loaves and fishes. Right. So in the context of support raising, you know, the disciples said, there's no. There's no food. They go to Jesus. There's all these people, there's no food. And Jesus said, go ask around. And he said, there's. They find this one boy has a tiny bit of food, and they're like, we don't know. We don't know what's going to happen. And Jesus takes that and multiplies it out and feeds thousands and thousands of people. Right. So, in the context of the person who's going to Jesus and saying, jesus, there's no money, what do I do? Jesus says, you know, again, like, Jesus is responsible for the provision that comes through and as the person who's doing the support raising in that role, kind of, if you're placing yourself in the story, the role of the disciple, you're responsible to go out in faith and ask, what do you guys have? How can you give? And that little boy had no clue when he said, I have five loaves and two fishes. He had no idea what Jesus was going to do with that, but he felt responsible to give it because he was being asked. And so in that same context, like, as we're going out and asking, we don't know, we don't know what the Lord is going to do with what is given. we don't know how much. But golly, like, Jesus is the one who in that story is ultimately going to do the miracle. Like, we don't have to worry about the miracle. He's going to take care of that part.

>> Andy:

And this reminds me too, of even a previous recap, and I think it was maybe Amy Young's recap where we talk about it's not a zero sum game. It's not like if I'm giving getting more than somebody else is getting less. Like it's God's economy and he's able to multiply.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It's a new dynamic, very different, especially coming from a western culture mindset that is so much a zero sum game when it comes to money.

>> Andy:

Right?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Like, that's how we think about money in general. But again, like you said, in God's economy, it's not, it's never a zero sum game to God.

>> Andy:

He has infinite resources.

>> Heather:

Yeah, yeah.

>> Andy:

Well, and that was encouraging too, to hear them talk about just how supportive their community and their church was and just the people around them. And I think for a first time fundraiser, and if you're going short term, there's a good chance that you are a first time fundraiser. It's so new to you and you're tempted to assume that this is new for everybody else, but it's not like these are, these are well established waters and this is a well established channel that everybody else is swimming in and you're just stepping into it for your first time. But they've given many other times.

>> Heather:

Yeah, I would say, andy, I would say that that's probably true for many of the streams in the north american church, but I would say that there are some churches within the north american church system that it is kind of new.

>> Andy:

Sure, it's not a blanket statement, but for, I would say the majority of people that I've talked to. That's probably a safe assumption.

>> Heather:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think, too, especially for the context of someone who's, coming out of. From the college age group, because they have probably never been approached for support raising.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

The context for them is going to feel different than for someone who is established in their career and may or may not have been approached themselves, with this type of a request. And so that. That unfamiliarity from that context might. Might cause some uncertainty for a younger age group.

>> Andy:

Yep, yep, yep. I talked about being anxious and insecure at first.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

Super normal.

>> Heather:

Yeah. And I was curious, you know, just. Danielle, I know you had many years specifically coaching people that were headed out into short term opportunities. I'm curious whether you heard a lot of what you heard then. In their words. Now, for example, they mentioned pride anxiety. Just curious, what did that bring up for you and your own experiences?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, I think all the exact same things. so I've had so many conversations, hundreds of conversations, literally, with people who are going through the process of raising support to serve. And it's almost always there's some level of fear that is either identified as anxiety or pride. And it's funny because, as they were talking through that, like, a meme came to mind, and I was like, this would be, like, this would be my prayer. Approach, support raising with the confidence of a mediocre white man who just assumes that everything's gonna go well. Right. Like, and there's a meme out there that says, like, approach life with the confidence of a mediocre white man who gets the yes. Right?

>> Andy:

Yeah, yeah. There's a meme for every occasion.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah. And it just came to mind. I was like, yeah, I would pray that for, like, people who are feeling like, oh, I'm going to get the no. And so if you're leading with that, I'm going to get a no. You're going to have that fear.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And I was also thinking through it, too, because there was some conversation about pride, and, like, I had to let go of my pride. And I think in that context, that language needs to be reframed, because pride is a sin, and if it's truly pride, we need to confess our sin, and we need to ask God to give us the confidence to overcome any fear or anxiety that we feel. Because if it is truly pride that I don't want to look dumb, I don't want to look like I need something. I don't want to look like I can't do something right if I am trusting in myself, and I don't want to let that go, man. That's a whole other conversation. But if it's anxiety or fear, we can ask for prayer and we can pray that God would give us the capacity to overcome those.

>> Andy:

And it's not a self confidence necessarily, as much as it is like a call confidence. Like, this is what I'm called to do in the moment, and he'll give me the strength to do that. Yeah. I wonder why we are so, and this is a big topic, so we don't get too much into it, but why we're so uncomfortable asking for money.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah. I think so much of that is, is the bootstrap culture of the west.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And I think that perm, that permeates into even Christianity, unfortunately, that the self confidence and self reliance of, I have to make my own way.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And that if I need help in any way, it's a weakness.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Or that if I don't just automatically have it, God has not provided it for me, it must not be what he wants. Right, right.

>> Andy:

God hasn't called me to ask for things. Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah. Yeah. M and that goes all the way through christian culture too. Right. Like, I have, I've experienced that with, serving in my local body as a deacon and members of the church having significant need that they don't even recognize it as a need that they could ask for help with. Right. So even outside of the context of gospel work, I think recognizing need and the ability for our community to support us financially or with other resources is really hard.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It's really hard to recognize in our.

>> Andy:

Individualistic culture, it feels like we shouldn't admit that we are insufficient or that we're vulnerable.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Right.

>> Andy:

But I feel like that's one of the beautiful things that fundraising does, is it forces us to accept that, that we are insufficient. And that's okay to be vulnerable when you're putting your trust in the one that can care for you that has infinite resources.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and I think that Christine touched on it too, like, because she was talking about her ability to self, support. M. Well, I think that there can be some time and place for that. And she was recognizing that the beauty of the body supporting one another and that God calls people to give and that's their role in his work that he's going to do, and that you're providing them an opportunity towards obedience in that. and I think that's just, it's a really good thing to remember is that if God is calling you to go. And there is an opportunity to support race and a need to support, raise. and sometimes, even if there's not a need, that your willingness to step outside of your comfort to communicate, what you're doing with other people and to put out that request, you're really offering an opportunity for someone to be obedient in their calling in the same way that you're being obedient in your calling, to be the person who goes.

>> Andy:

And you have to get it into your mind. Young fundraiser. You are not a burden. No God has directed, he has ordained. I think you could say that people to give right, like this is built into our, you know, our culture, into our tax code. people have budgeted for it in a lot of cases. So, you are not a burden.

>> Heather:

One last thing to what you were saying regarding Christine and talking about self funding, I really loved that she articulated it as not self funding is an act of worship.

>> Andy:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

>> Heather:

And even saying it would be selfish of me to not invite others into it. So, yeah. And even to what you just said, I mean, you're not a burden. It would actually be selfish not to invite others in.

>> Andy:

And it's ultimately not transactional. Yeah, that's hard in the context that we live in. We live in pyramid, you know, scheme societies. And I've got a great deal for you type of things, but it's really missional. Like you said, it's gospel centered. it's mobilizing the body of Christ. and I think, like, our attention as the body of Christ, we just had a sermon, a series about our attention. At our church, it's filled with so many competing things. Right. And so we really are doing them a favor by giving them something else to focus on. And it's not that we don't care about all these things, but I think we're just so saturated with news and with information and content, it's hard for us to know, like, what should I pray about today? There's so many things in the world. Sometimes it's just overwhelming, for a lot of people. So, we just need a reason to care about this. And if I know that my friend is going to Uzbekistan or Tunisia or Indonesia or whatever, that gives me a reason to invest in that and do some research and pray about it. So it's not that we're callous necessarily, it's just that, we're too saturated.

>> Heather:

I think something else I wanted to go back to, it's, you know, when we were talking about anxiety and moving through anxiety. And I was really struck by something that actually, I think, Andy, you said where you were saying that we can project our anxiety and fears onto the people that we're talking to. And that reminded me of the conversation that we had with Steve Cuss. And he confirmed, like, in his. His research around anxiety and the kind of anxiety that is contagious, as he would say that, when you go into these opportunities and communicate with anxiety, it is definitely felt by the people that you're communicating to. And how does that kind of muddy up what the spirit might be trying to do?

>> Andy:

Yep, that's good.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think I could identify myself when they were talking about the type of person who gives. Right. So looking towards who their. What their donor base is being established families, or more typically, going to be people who are established in their career. And, And then they were also talking about, Andy, you asked the question, like, do people just give or do you have to follow up? And I think about myself in the context of someone who is deeply, ah, passionate about gospel centered work, international gospel centered work. Right. I've participated myself. I have mobilized lots and lots of people to go, but I am currently in a season of life with small, children and a full time job. And so my call is not currently to go. My call would be to pray or to give. so if someone were to approach me, I would be in that position to hear where they're going, pray about if God is calling me to give. Certainly praying for them either way. but the follow up, me as a mom of two kids.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I'm gonna. I'm gonna need some follow up.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And it's not. It's not cause I'm ignoring you. It's not because it's a no, it's. It's simply because the volume of needs in my life that are directed towards me is high, it's noisy, and you're going to have to get through that. And so it might just. It might just take persistence.

>> Andy:

Yeah. that's so good. It's not the job of the donor to keep following up with the. The missionary, with the guy who's going. Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, it is. Yeah. It just takes a lot.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It just. And not at any fault of the person who is doing the asking. Not. It's not you.

>> Heather:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

That's a message that I want to get across very clearly. Like, if you have a person who has said yes to meeting with you and you have shared with them what you want to do. And they have not followed up with you. Listen, if they've said yes to meeting with you, they're a person who cares about. They're in and cares about what you want.

>> Andy:

Yeah. And they didn't say no.

>> Danielle Nelson:

They're not trying to be mean.

>> Andy:

So true.

>> Danielle Nelson:

They are not. And so thinking the best of intentions for that person and just kindly and politely continuing to follow up until you get the know, like, yeah, don't feel. Don't feel ashamed of, like, pushing until you actually get them to tell you no, that's okay, too.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

And I've been on that, on the side of a donor, too, and have somebody that consistently follows up with me. And I'm like, man, I know I've, I told this guy that I wanted to give, and I really do, and I appreciate that he's being persistent, so that I can just take it off of my mind. M and I'll get to it when I get to it. I know it's not ideal, but, you know, there's plates that are spinning.

>> Heather:

Yeah. I mean, we say a lot that your urgency is not their urgency. And, you know, like Daniel, as you articulated, depending on what people have going on in their lives, there's just so many things that could keep their attention off of, you know, that, that return text or whatever. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I would say, too, like, don't be afraid to use technology to your benefit as a support raiser. And I know that some of that is going to be limited, based on the organization that you're serving with or however it is that you're going about collecting funds, but remove, any clicks. Right. How many clicks does it take for your donor to actually complete the process of giving? Are you removing any of those barriers? Right. Is there a hyperlink in the text message that you send? Like, can you make it as easy as that? Because I think even about the things in my life that I'm more likely to respond quickly to are the ones that I don't have to initiate anything beyond pushing a button. Right. If I can make it. If you can make it as easy as just pushing a button, you might see a good return on your investment of how much time you spend reaching out and how many times.

>> Heather:

Yeah, yeah. That's good. While we're kind of, like, on some practical tips. You got any others just from your own experience that you would want to submit that maybe weren't represented in the episode?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, I'm dating myself in that here. This is how old I am. And I think that the game has changed a lot. So, I did support raising before iPhones were invented. I just think of it now, and I think, like, oh, man, there's so many things I would like. My brain starts spinning of, like, things I could do differently now. I think QR codes. Use a QR code. How can think creatively? How can I use a QR code to immediately direct someone, whether that's for the first time or a follow up or even while you're serving, if you have. If you're able to communicate with your donor base by sending out a QR code for them to have access to an update or afterwards. So, yeah, finding creative ways to use technology to communicate, I think, is really important. And again, removing as much barrier to the information as you can, the immediacy. Our culture is so used to immediacy. If we can. If you can't beat them, join them. Right. Like, figure out how to be that.

>> Andy:

Yeah. We've kind of. We've allowed ourselves to be programmed to want things immediately. And so if you're asking yourself, your network, to actually, I need you to go this and this and this and this, and then you got to set up your ach giving, from your bank, and then you, like, that's just a recipe for failure, I think. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And I would say, on the flip side of that, don't solely rely on technology.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I would say I still receive paper newsletters for people that I have mobilized, and I love them because I'm forced. I'm physically forced to read it, put it on my fridge, and then eventually throw it away.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

So I have three touch points with that communication without that person having to do anything. right. So that's also a good way to have that, like, communicate. Like, you're communicating more times than you think you are with a newsletter.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Or with a, with a prayer. Right. If that goes on someone's fridge, a picture.

>> Andy:

So the old school way.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Again, old school. But it works, right? Thousands of people were mobilized before we had email.

>> Andy:

Absolutely. Well, it's more and more of an anomaly in this day and age, and it takes up actual physical, like you said, physical space and real estate in your immediate environment versus this, you know, 2d on a screen.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

I will say that I have, I don't know, maybe three or four newsletters sitting in my email inbox right now that I have not read yet, and I have several sitting on my counter that I have, to some degree, engaged.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

And. Yeah. And I'm just me. I'm not everybody but I just wonder how many other people have the thing where they open their email and they see multiple things mixed in with, you know, your medical bill is due and your kids soccer camp is starting and, you know, great aunt Susie emailed you. Like, there's just a lot going on in our, in our inboxes, but yeah, Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think too, like, read your communication and see how long it takes you to read it is a good tip.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Because I think that there's probably a one to two minute attention span, unfortunately. again, back to that immediacy culture. Right. Like, we're. Yeah. Instagram and TikTok have put us on a countdown timer of attention span. And if it takes you more than a minute to read through what you've written, you've probably lost. Like, if you've not gotten your pitch in that first part and you're relying on the bottom to be what is red, man, you might have lost your audience by then.

>> Andy:

What is that? There's some statistic out there that says the average. Maybe it's american, maybe it's. Everybody has less attention now than a goldfish.

>> Heather:

hm.

>> Andy:

Have you heard that?

>> Heather:

I feel like I've heard something like that. No, I feel like I've heard something like that.

>> Andy:

Yeah, I've heard that.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It feels like it, for sure. I mean, that resonates with me.

>> Andy:

Yeah, I feel.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I feel convicted.

>> Andy:

Yeah. Yeah.

>> Heather:

While we're talking about communication, I do also want to just highlight that they, and we've said this prior, but they did talk about the importance of story, and that reminded me of yet another conversation that we've had with Clyde. And Clyde just talked about the importance of communicating with dignity and the way you tell a story and the way you posture the people that you're talking about how important that is. And I think it's just good to always remember that when you're telling stories, and especially telling stories to move people to just really hold intention, keeping dignity at the forefront in those conversations and in those stories so that you're never reducing a person to a project. and maybe trying to pull on heartstrings in that way, but really just representing the gospel. These people do not know Jesus and I desire for them too. And there might be other circumstances around their situation, like poverty or lack of access to resources, things like that, but just always important in telling those stories to maintain dignity.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think, ironically, Clyde is one of those newsletters that sits around on my fridge every time it comes through. And those are people, and those are stories. That resonate with my heart consistently and I pray for them consistently. and it's. Again, it is not the tragedy of their story that captivates my heart. Their story is told in a way that I see them as people. Who either desperately need the gospel or are dear brothers and sisters in Christ.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And I love those stories. I cherish those when those come through in my inbox.

>> Andy:

And it might be faster to communicate with like bullet points, for example. But I think as humans, we are just wired for stories and for narratives. And most, most of us aren't just like coldly logical. Like, give me the data, give me the facts and I'll make a decision. Like, we need, we need some like commissional, real world flesh put on those, those bones. I think, And the struggle though, I think for a first time fundraiser and that you haven't been before is that you don't really have your own stories to tell.

>> Heather:

Right.

>> Andy:

Yet. That is a challenge, but hopefully that doesn't stop you. I mean, consider the difference. Like, let's say you're going to Indonesia. Pick a random country and you're like, I'm serving in Indonesia this summer because, well, it's a majority Muslim. I have summer free. And they need to be exposed to the truth. Okay, so you're giving them the bullet points versus like, that's true, but versus like telling it like a story. So talking to a friend. So there I was, and I was, I was sitting in a perspectives class and the teacher was wrapping up the lesson and she started talking about Indonesia and she said this, like, instantly that feels a little more compelling. And I'm drawn into it because it's a narrative. The same information is being relayed in both situations, but the second way feels better. It's more engaging, by default, because we want to put ourselves in other people's shoes. So I think when you tell it as a story, that really helps.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think another way you can also tell it as a story when you don't have your own story is to, relate it to a gospel narrative of Jesus interacting with the lost. Right. And not to be like, weird about it, like, oh, I'm going to, Indonesia because there's people who are lost there and it reminds me of this story and you're in it. It has to speak to your heart. Right. It has to be from a genuine place of like, relating to, like, I see Jesus interacting with the lost in this way and I have a desire to relate to the lost of this country in the way that Jesus did it through this story and sharing that story. Because I think that a believer will also resonate with that as well, outside of the location or the culture. Right. Because if we're again going back to the gospel is radically transformative. The gospel is then what is motivating the potential donor, not necessarily their connection to a locality. Yeah, because that can be hard, too, right? Like, if you're approaching someone and you're like, I don't know if they're going to give. Like, I know that they always give to someone who's in this part of the world and I'm going to the opposite side of the globe. Like, maybe they don't have a heart for those people. Well, maybe that's true. But do they have a heart for the gospel going to the lost? Because that's what it's about ultimately. Because, you know, God can interact in people's hearts in different ways. And maybe it is that the person who's going to donate is not motivated to that specific culture, doesn't have a connection to the place where you're going, but is genuinely in love with Jesus and wants other people to be genuinely in love with Jesus. And if that's your story, that's super compelling.

>> Heather:

Yeah, yeah. And I just, I really appreciate it. I think it was Bryn. She even made the comment that she competes in. I think it was speech and debate. Speech and debate, yeah, she competes in that and she still finds herself learning to communicate better. And so I think that's just a good reminder that you're not just going to be an optimized communicator necessarily. You need to hold intention, doing what you can to communicate, well, passionately, you know, clearly, compellingly. And then also trust that it's not going to come down to your words that God, the power in the gospel isn't in the way we present it, it's in what it is, you know?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah. I feel like I coached a lot of introverts in my time. Mobilizing and just the encouragement, like, it's not a class presentation. Like just, it's a conversation. Like, don't. Don't feel like, don't feel like you're getting graded, you're not, right. That's not what this is. And if you forget, you know, the second point that you were going to try and make, that's okay. Just get out there, get into the conversation and pray that God is going to honor your time. Time and the time of the person that you're speaking to, and that the right thing is going to be communicated regardless of whether you hit your kind of mark, step by step through what you're wanting to get through.

>> Andy:

Yeah. It's not about your performance. Yeah.

>> Heather:

And it can actually be so counterproductive to be hyper focused on that. Even in the best of intentions, when we have an agenda and our focus is on that, then we're not as free to just kind of move with the way the spirit directs. Right. I mean, even in these conversations, even in podcast interviews, if we were to just kind of rigidly stick to our, pre thought through questions, there'd be so many we'd miss m moments that the spirit broke in, you know?

>> Andy:

Yeah. And people sense agendas.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

We really do.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

Something you just said, danielle, made me think, like, what about this idea that I think a lot of maybe younger people have is like, I just don't have the time to do this. Well, how do I fit this into my schedule? I'm already maxed out on my credits or even m working full time. How do I do that? Any thoughts about that?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah. Multitasking is a productivity lie.

>> Andy:

Okay. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

That is really easy to believe. And so if you think, oh, well, I'm just going to do this while I'm doing this other thing, set it aside. It's counterintuitive to think like, oh, I got to find an hour. But if you are able to find an hour where you only do one thing and one thing only, you'd be amazed how much you can get done.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Turn off your devices. If you're using a device that you have to use in order to do your task, turn off your notifications.

>> Andy:

But what if somebody texts me and needs and needs my feedback?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Right? I mean, turn it off. put it on do not disturb. And I know that that's really hard, and it's counterintuitive because we genuinely believe. I mean, I even. I know this, and I don't do it right. Like, it's hard to turn everything off and focus on one thing at a time. And you'd be amazed how much you can get done by literally batching your activities. in the business world, like, I have to turn off my email for a specific period of time every day. If I have a set amount of tasks that I need to accomplish that I know I need to get done without being interrupted, I am far less productive if I'm constantly stopping and starting another thing. And that's. That's just categorically true. Based on research.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It's not just. Right, what I'm saying. Like, I just know that it's true. Every time you get interrupted in a thought process, you have to. It takes so much more time to get back into it, to reengage.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, I get it. There's not time. There's more time than you think.

>> Andy:

Yeah. It doesn't take as long as you think.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Right. Right.

>> Heather:

Or it doesn't have to if you're not doing five other things.

>> Andy:

Right. Right. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I'd like to say that I don't have enough time to fold and put away my laundry because it so consistently sits in a laundry basket for much longer than it probably should.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

When in reality it's just a non preferred task. Right. I have time to do it. I just either, for some reason, am putting it off because I know that it's not very pleasant. And I think in the world of fundraising, if you are finding yourself in the place where you're saying, I don't have enough time, maybe ask yourself, the question is, for some reason, this just a non preferred task. M and why is it a non preferred task? What is it that is causing me and not want to jump in and tackle this? Because I think if you can be really honest with yourself and ask that question, the whole process is going to be a lot more enjoyable for you.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Because you're not going to be dreading conversations. You're not going to be putting off sending a follow up email. You're not going to be questioning whether or not you're doing the right thing. If you've really addressed in your heart, why is it that I'm hesitant towards jumping in and making this a priority? It's going to go a lot smoother for you.

>> Heather:

Yeah. Well, and, you know, I don't want this to sound like kind of a Sunday school cliche, but Jesus really is sufficient for your every need. So understanding what it is that's keeping you from doing whatever it is you need to do, understanding the need there, you really can invite the Lord into that in a very real way, you know?

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah.

>> Heather:

Back to what you said at the very beginning, Danielle, just talking about how both Brynn and Christine come from very different seasons and circumstances. I think it was really helpful to see, you know, whether you are a student with many hours that you're working towards and a job and commitments, or whether you're someone that's out in the workforce. I felt like Brynn and Christine really gave us great insight into some practical ways that they tried to do the things that they needed to do. You know, when you talked about batching, it kind of reminds me of how Bryn said that she just kind of had in view that every time she went home, she was kind of pairing that with working on her support, raising, meeting with people, things like that. So that feels like a really practical way to make the time. I'm trying to remember if Christine spoke directly to how she made the time.

>> Andy:

I feel like she was more organic in it, and kind of just whenever an opportunity came up. I'm going to walk.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

She talked about, like, capitalizing on, like, lunchtime conversations with co workers. and again, like, yeah. Praying about if I don't have the time, where in my everyday life are there opportunities that I wouldn't identify as opportunities to speak with someone about support raising that God is providing inside the context of what's already going on.

>> Heather:

Right.

>> Danielle Nelson:

That I don't have to make time. It's already. It's already happening. It's already there.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

It's just a shift in the focus.

>> Andy:

Of the conversation, and it's gonna. Fundraising is going to disrupt your life. It is going to be. You disrupt your schedule to expect that you're gonna be able to get fully funded without any disruption. I mean, we don't really think that, but sometimes our actions betray that assumption.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yes.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yep. I think they both touched on something really interesting, too, in terms of casting the net really broadly versus diving in more specifically. That I think is really good, a good reminder for people who are support raising. I think oftentimes, especially first time fundraisers, go into the process thinking, oh, broadly, I'll make an announcement at my church.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Or I'll talk to a Sunday school class. I'll do a good first step, but the number of people who are probably going to give based on an announcement or a group presentation is pretty small.

>> Andy:

So low.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And I think that that's a. That's a good reminder that. That really, the majority of support that's raised and funds that are given are based on a personal one on one conversation.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

and having that expectation early on that the broad announcement is a knock on the door to a second and third and sometimes fourth conversation before funds will actually come in.

>> Andy:

Right.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

And you might not feel the. Maybe you feel like, well, I've got tons of time. I'm not going to the summer. I've got months and months and months and months. The other question that you have to ask yourself is, is it really respectful or honoring to the other piece of the equation. The donor. If I'm waiting until June and I need the money in July, like, it feels like it's a little bit disrespectful to say, I need the money. I need it right now.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yeah, they can. Yeah. It at least gives them a very short timeline for response.

>> Andy:

Yeah, yeah.

>> Heather:

And I mean, I guess to maybe have a more positive bent on it. What could it do to kind of like extend that partnership? So let's say you're leaving in the summer and you're positioned to know what you're going to be doing in October of the previous year. What could it look like to start gathering a team and have all that time from October till June or whatever for people to be mindfully thinking about what you're going to be doing in Indonesia or Palestine or wherever. Right. Like it extends the focus. It's not just about the financial provision, it's about the anticipation. Hey, I'm going to have an opportunity to have boots on the ground in this part of the world, at this date. And I am praying until then the gospel would move in power. Would you join me in praying until then that the gospel would move in power? You know, and just, I mean, I don't know, I just, I feel like when we have the opportunity to have our attention arrested in the vision of what God could do, it's just good.

>> Andy:

And I'm starting to ideate even as you're starting to talk about this, like maybe you're sending out like a monthly like a little post. Like here's a photo of where I'm going. Here's something to pray for.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

And start getting them, getting them primed and ready of like, man, this is going to be awesome. Here's the needs. I really want to pray for this. Well. Versus just kind of a flash in the pan experience.

>> Heather:

Yeah. Because, okay, totally different subject matter. But think about when somebody's going to have a baby. You don't just care when the baby arrives. There's like all kinds of anticipation happening throughout that process and you want to hear about updates as that happens or people that are getting married or you know, somebody that's going off to college. We just like to anticipate and look forward to and watch the journey, you know, that's good.

>> Danielle Nelson:

I think that gives also the follow ups have more substance. Right. If you are following, if you have a longer time horizon. Right. And you've spoken with someone, you've asked them to pray, you've asked them to give, and you've got enough lead time to follow up graciously by also then having like what Andy was talking about. This is something exciting that I'm learning about that place. This is, you know, a picture. this is the food that I'm excited that we might get to try. You know, I think it continues to tell the story, which is coupled with then the follow up reminder. And I think that that's so much more gracious than just the just, hey, can you give?

>> Andy:

Hey, can you give? Yeah. Right? Yeah. It's a very, a very kind way to just kind of nudge and say, I'm still here, still going.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Well, and maybe, and I don't know, for me also as a person who, if I put myself in the shoes of the person who support raising, feels a little less direct.

>> Andy:

Yes.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Which I might find more comfort in.

>> Andy:

Easier to do, much easier. Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

If I'm having to ask for multiple times for follow up, it might feel a little more comfortable if it's not the only thing I'm asking.

>> Andy:

Yeah. And this is something that I would talk to a long term missionary, about as well. Like when you're communicating back home, you don't want to have an ask in every single email or every single newsletter. You don't want to saturate them because it actually desensitizes them to the ask. So you want to provide. I don't know what the ratio would be, but like a ten to one ratio of like, I'm going to give you awesome content that's going to inform you and edify you and encourage you. And then once a year I'm going to ask for finances so that people aren't overwhelmed by all this guy cares about is the money and getting funded. I think that can be a little overwhelming.

>> Heather:

Well, as we wrap up our conversation, any final encouragement, Danielle, to people that might find themselves fundraising for a short term opportunity.

>> Danielle Nelson:

If fundraising is new to you, and you are feeling anxiety or concern or worry, take it to Jesus. He is with you, he has called you and he will guide you through this. And it might not always be comfortable, but it's an opportunity for you to be sanctified, to become more like Christ, to be more vulnerable. And you will be different for the rest of your life, not just because of what you do during whatever period of summer or short term trip that's going to be transformative. That trip is going to transform you. Support raising will also radically transform you if you allow God to work in your heart through it. and I think that for people who are new to support raising, that can be a really hard truth to understand. but it's true. And then for people who are seasoned, God bless you for walking in obedience in something that, you know, probably from your prior experience is sanctifying and is maybe at times going to be uncomfortable. Your faithfulness and willingness to say yes again, despite knowing what challenges you may be facing in this process. Lord bless you in that. Like that. That is an amazing thing to walk in faith when you know it might be hard.

>> Andy:

Yeah.

>> Danielle Nelson:

And so God bless you in it. Walk through it. He's faithful. He's called you. And I'm not going to say it's going to be easier the second time because sometimes it's not, or even the third or fourth time, but if he's called you to do it, he's going to be faithful to walk you through this process.

>> Andy:

Such a good reminder that God doesn't, I don't think, speak to us through difficulty. Like, he doesn't say this is not my will because it's difficult.

>> Heather:

Yeah.

>> Andy:

Right. He asked us to do hard things. He asked us to do challenging things. And that's good for us to struggle through it.

>> Heather:

Yep. It's definitely a formative process for our good.

>> Danielle Nelson:

Yes.

>> Heather:

Yeah. Well, thank you again so much, Danielle, for joining us today and helping us recap this important conversation. Thank you again to Bryn and Christine and Sarah for your contribution to the episode.

>> Andy:

That was rich. I, hope it's helpful too.

>> Heather:

Yes, may it be.

>> Andy:

It's not about the money is presented by Provisio fundraising solutions, provisio equips, support based workers with flexible training, practical resources and one on one coaching. Find out more@provisiofundraising.com.