54. Church Partnership 3 (mini series)

Episode 54 emphasizes reframing fundraising as an invitation for churches to join God’s mission, rather than a transactional process. The discussion covers best practices for approaching churches, finding advocates, aligning with like-minded congregations, and maintaining a mindset of prayer and humble confidence. Practical strategies include starting with one’s home church, leveraging personal connections, and ensuring theological and missional alignment with potential partners.

[01:00 - 05:00] Approaching Your Home Church & Timing Considerations

The episode begins by discussing how to approach a home church for partnership. Corrie advises identifying the right contact, such as a missions committee or pastor, and avoiding impromptu pitches in casual settings like church hallways. Timing is critical—setting up a formal meeting allows for better engagement. Andy notes that church leaders juggle many responsibilities, so missionaries should not misinterpret a leader’s busyness as disinterest. Corrie adds that churches outside one’s home congregation may take time to commit, preferring to observe a missionary’s work before partnering.

[05:00 - 10:00] Leveraging Personal Connections & Finding Advocates

The conversation shifts to approaching churches beyond one’s home congregation by leveraging personal connections, such as friends, neighbors, or community members involved in other churches. Corrie suggests identifying individuals with a heart for missions who can act as advocates. Andy references Steve Shadrach’s advice to personally ask church leaders for support to build stronger relationships. The group discusses the value of seeking advice from influential church members, which can foster investment and open doors to broader church support.

[10:00 - 16:00] The Role of Advocates and Managing Relationships

This segment emphasizes the importance of advocates within churches. Effective advocates are passionate about the missionary’s ministry, well-connected, and proactive in facilitating events or introductions. Corrie shares her experience of relying on advocates to organize speaking engagements and events, reducing logistical burdens. The group discusses the need for clear communication and a formal “ask” for advocacy, similar to a support request, and suggests maintaining a core team or advocate manager to streamline communication with multiple churches.

[16:00 - 22:00] Approaching Churches Without Connections & Building Long-Term Relationships

The discussion addresses “cold approaches” to churches with no prior connections, which are less effective but sometimes necessary. Corrie recommends identifying smaller churches, which may be more receptive due to fewer missionary requests. She advises attending church events, delivering a brief elevator pitch, and requesting a formal meeting. Andy suggests that some denominations expect missionaries to visit multiple churches, a process called deputation. Corrie shares an example of a church that began supporting her financially after two years of consistent communication, highlighting the value of long-term relationship-building.

[26:00 - 39:00] Ensuring Alignment & Practical Mindsets

The final segment focuses on ensuring theological and missional alignment with churches to avoid mismatched partnerships. Corrie suggests researchi

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Transcript

Heather Winchell: Hello. Welcome back to our mini series on church partnerships. This is Heather, joined again today by Andy and Corey. Welcome guys. 

Andy Brennan: Hello. ~Hey.~ 

Heather Winchell: And we are going to be talking about a wide variety of topics related to finding churches, finding advocates, when you have to start from scratch and so on. When it comes to church partnerships and fundraising, the approach we take makes all the difference.

Too often support raising can feel like a transactional process. Seeking financial backing to sustain ministry work. What if we reframed it? What if instead of looking for churches to fund us, we saw ourselves as casting a vision for churches to join in God's mission.

This subtle but powerful shift can transform the way we engage with congregations. So today we'll explore how to prepare for these connections guided by both biblical principles and practical strategies. [00:01:00] How does a strong theological foundation shape our approach to church partnerships? What changes when we see fundraising, not just as financial support, but as an invitation to something greater.

So I wanna get us started by looking specifically at what you do to find churches to ask. So in the module we talk about beginning with your home church, and I guess Corey, I'd love to just get started with some. Best practices for approaching a person's own church for partnership and then what common stakes we could avoid in that?

Corrie Mckee: Hmm, good question. I think the first thing would be to start with, ~um, ~asking what is available at the church. Like is there a missions committee that you should go to? Is there a missions pastor? Some churches have a specific elder that's focused on missions, or if it's just a small church. Maybe just talking to that pastor, but knowing the right [00:02:00] person to go to first ~is, ~is where you would start.

Andy Brennan: Mm-hmm. 

Corrie Mckee: I think one of the things to avoid is, just the timing of that conversation and, making sure that the timing is right, and not assuming that you can bring up everything as soon as you talk to that person. Like catch them in the hallway and just start to tell your whole mission story.

You know, I've definitely learned the hard way on that, but just, setting up an actual time to meet and then sharing a little bit more. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah, I think that's really good counsel, Corey, because I can imagine that, you know, when people are preparing to talk to somebody and they're excited about what they're doing, maybe they see them after church and think, oh, this is an opportunity, and the person that they approach might be genuinely interested to hear more, but it might not be the setting for that.

Corrie Mckee: Yeah, 

Heather Winchell: that's true. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. So if they start to ask a lot of questions, you can just say, Hey, I'd love to share more. We can set up a time to meet and I'll tell you more about [00:03:00] it. 

Andy Brennan: And I think just having never spin on church staff myself, but I think that my, my impression is that my pastors are always spinning a lot of plates.

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. 

Andy Brennan: They have a lot of people pulling on them and asking them to help and they like to do that. But don't mistake their need to move on to something else as disinterest. Is that what we're saying too? 

Heather Winchell: Right? Yes. So don't linger too long in a moment.

That's not set up well for them to really hear and be able to engage. And also, don't write it off if they don't have time to linger. 

Andy Brennan: I think in my experience as well. Things tend to move a little bit slower in church world than they do in like corporate America especially, but even in nonprofit world that we live in, that we work in. So just if you have a very narrow window, a very short runway before a decision needs to be made, just know that that is adding additional [00:04:00] challenges, 

Heather Winchell: right.

Corrie Mckee: I was gonna say, I think also some churches may want to see that you are serious about what you're doing and what you're saying. And so if the church is not your home church, they may stand back a little bit. Watch you do your mission for a while.

Get your newsletters, read about your work, learn about it, and then come on board later. Mm-hmm. Right. That's definitely happening for me. 

Andy Brennan: They want to ease into it a little bit. 

Corrie Mckee: Right. 

Andy Brennan: Yeah. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. And since you mentioned churches that are not your own home church, I guess I would like to kind of push into that a little bit.

Just ask, you know, beyond your home church, we do encourage people to be aware of the personal connections they have to other churches and to not be shy about leveraging those connections in order to have opportunity to speak to other churches. ~How, ~how would you counsel someone to effectively [00:05:00] identify and approach churches?

They do have indirect ties to. 

Corrie Mckee: I would say the first thing is to look where your personal connections are. And just look at your friend group. Look at your, the people in your community or people that you've known in the past, like people who are really involved in their churches. Maybe they're in some type of leadership.

Or, there's churches that you may have partnered with and some projects in your community, or you partnered with on a mission trip before. Maybe you have ~a, a, ~a neighbor who's an elder in their church, or, your doctor is on their missions committee at their church.

Different things that you may not even have thought about. Just people in your daily life who are very involved in their church and have a heart for missions. Those would be great people to help you get your foot in the door. 

Andy Brennan: Hmm.

Okay. So let's explore something really quickly that, we've talked about before. This idea that Steve Shadrach has [00:06:00] when you're partnering with churches is to go to the leader and ask that person, for support to deepen that relationship. What do we think about that? 

Corrie Mckee: So you're saying like, personally ask that person for their family to be on your support team even before their church gets on board?

Andy Brennan: Yeah. ~I think that's the way I'm reading it. Yeah.~ 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. I think it's a great idea. I can't think of an example where I've done it in the past. Um, 'cause the, the God Ask Book was not out yet when I was fundraising ~and it mm-hmm.~ 

Andy Brennan: It 

Corrie Mckee: honestly never occurred to me. But now after reading this quote from Steve, I'm just thinking that that would be a great foundation because then that pastor could really be an advocate and they could say, my family is personally.

Giving to this missionary, and this is why I think we all should too. 

Andy Brennan: I also don't think I experienced that personally, but I do agree with it in theory. Yeah, I think it sounded great in [00:07:00] theory. I'll also reference something that I learned from one of our other guests on the show, Mary Valloni.

I remember very distinctly, this was burned to my memory. She was talking to her co-host, Mike Kim, and they were talking about approaching people in authority, or some people with influence or people with a lot of money, and ~they said ~they suggested instead of asking for money directly from those people, instead of asking for advice, they said, if you ask for money, there's a good chance you're gonna get advice.

But if you ask for advice. Somehow my interpretation is that they're more bought in and they're more invested instantly by giving you advice and they want to see you succeed. ~So maybe there's also money involved in that to some extent.~ 

Heather Winchell: Mm. ~Mm-hmm.~ 

Andy Brennan: So that would be an interesting thing ~to, to, uh, ~to try out.

Corrie Mckee: Well, and those people have so much experience of dealing with, ~um, ~missionaries and others who are raising support, and ~they, ~they know what's up, so they can help you. 

Andy Brennan: Right, right. And they know the individuals in their church, especially if you've never been to that church or you have a very loose connection, how do you even know [00:08:00] where to start?

So that, I think also just makes logical sense to go to them and say, Hey, this is your body. You have shepherded this group. Where would you start if you were me? 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. That's really great. Well, in speaking of advocates, ~I, ~I would also like to push into ~why, ~why do we think it is important to have an advocate within a church setting?

~What and ~what makes an effective advocate? Because you could find somebody connected to the church, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it will be a helpful advocate. So what are your thoughts on that, guys? 

Corrie Mckee: It's gotta be someone who is excited about your ministry. First and foremost, they, I mean, yes, they do need to be well connected within their church, but I don't think that's necessarily the primary thing.

~Um hmm. ~They're excited about your ministry. Then they will go and find the people they need to connect with to tell them about your ministry.

Andy Brennan: So it doesn't need to be somebody who's been on the mission field before necessarily. Right. But just someone who has a heart for. The great commission, the heart for [00:09:00] international or whatever you're doing doesn't have to be international. Yeah, 

Corrie Mckee: yeah. So it could be like, I've seen so many different types of advocates in my fundraising journey.

Sometimes it's someone who's already on my financial partnership team, ~um, ~and they're supporting me, so they want other people too, as well. Or sometimes it's someone who doesn't have the financial resources or ability to support me, but they know a lot of people, so they wanna tell everybody about it. ~Um, and so, you know, ~this happened to me when ~I, ~I started fundraising right out of college and I had a lot of college friends who were.

~Also ~just as poor as me, and they couldn't support me, but ~they, ~they came from a lot of churches and ~so ~they would help me get connected to their pastors and their churches ~and, ~and that ended up being a huge blessing. 

Andy Brennan: And I think that carries over. It makes sense, right? That carries over that when you are funded and you are on the field to maintain those advocate relationships.[00:10:00] 

Because again, going back to what we said earlier, the people in leadership have a lot of plate spinning. If you are just a very like secondary, tertiary plate ~on their, ~in their orbit, ~man, ~it's very likely that they're not gonna think about you very much unless somebody is there saying, Hey, what about Corey?

We haven't heard from her lately. Let's reach out to her. Hmm. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. So true. And I think those advocates can, like, especially ~if, ~if the church is not your home church, those advocates can help you, ~um, ~plan events and speaking engagements. 

Andy Brennan: ~Hmm. ~So 

Corrie Mckee: they can help talk with the pastor and get you set up to come and share.

They can organize a. Potluck or ~a, ~an ice cream social or something for you. And it would, it's gonna go a lot [00:11:00] better with them organizing it than with you coming in and introducing yourself as a stranger and, you know, so letting them take their reins on that. 

Heather Winchell: Mm-hmm. 

Andy Brennan: ~That's, ~that's huge. ~Yeah. ~Who, like, people might not even remember who you are.

~Right. ~And you're coming in saying, Hey, ~have a, ~let's have a meeting about this. Plus it takes a lot of weight off your shoulders. ~Like to me, ~if I had, how many churches did you have, Corey? You have like 12. ~12 churches. ~The idea of managing all that clerical, logistical detail and setting all those up in different locations, that make me not want to do that.

Corrie Mckee: No, no. I mean, I would usually, when I was traveling through to visit, I had like a church tour that I did, and so mm-hmm. I would just tell people, Hey, this is when I'm gonna be in town. ~Um, ~you wanna set something up? And they would set it up and tell me when to be there, and I would just come prepared to share, but they would have all the details figured out.

So you had some amazing advocates. 

Andy Brennan: ~You had, ~you had roadies. 

Corrie Mckee: Mm-hmm. ~I did. ~I did. Yep. ~Yep. It was a, ~it was a seven. [00:12:00] State 12 church tour 

Heather Winchell: every time 

Corrie Mckee: we met. ~Yep.~ 

Heather Winchell: Wow. That is really cool. ~Yeah. Yeah. ~So it seems like it would be very important for an advocate to be somebody with some level of maybe proactiveness, very dependable, high communication , good rapport between you, clear communication.

It sounds like the nature of this kind of partnership, you know, partnering as an advocate ~would, ~would feel a little bit more formal than just saying, Hey, would you be willing it, or ~to, I don't know. ~To what extent do you think that that would need to be kind of like a core team where people are kind of making a commitment and to what extent is it just kind of one off or more casual?

What do you guys think? 

Corrie Mckee: I think it's important to make the ask to your advocate like you would make an ask for support. 

Heather Winchell: Hmm. 

Corrie Mckee: And, you know, really make sure that they understand your ministry and that you've done your ministry [00:13:00] presentation and shared that with them first. ~Um, and really then. ~Lay out for them how they can help you specifically.

So instead of a normal presentation where you're saying, you know, this is what I need at this much per month, lay it out as this is what I need in terms of communication, in terms of networking, in terms of contacts, and then, you know, let them know what you think the next steps might be. Ask them who they know and then start to really brainstorm together ~and, and, ~and ask them, like give them some time to think about it.

But, ~you know, ~ask them if they would be willing ~to, ~to commit to helping you network within that church. 

Heather Winchell: Mm-hmm. 

Andy Brennan: So you as the asker, really need to have your ducks in a row. You, ~you really ~need to have thought through all the ramifications of what you're actually asking them to do. 

Corrie Mckee: Yes, that's right. You need to think through, like, especially if you're going to be full-time, ~you know, ~long-term fundraiser.

This means, ~you know, ~two, three years from now [00:14:00] when you come back home on furlough, this person needs to be keeping up with you. Reminding the church leaders about you coming, helping to organize something, et cetera. It doesn't always have to be a ~super, you know, big deal or ~big event, but at least they should be in the know and committed to reminding people about you.

Andy Brennan: You wanna avoid a sense of surprises Yes. Down the road. Yeah. There should be no surprises. ~Yeah. ~But what about the core team thing? ~Um, ~Heather, you asked about should they be on the core team? That's an interesting question because if it was like, I've got two churches, that to me says yes, okay, I can, I can unfold two people that maybe I don't know as well into my core team, and that makes sense to me.

But if I had 12 churches like Corey, that makes me want to think of, maybe I need a secondary like advocate team or something where I have ~a, ~a, my core, core team, ~my, ~my bullseye team, and then I have this other. [00:15:00] Layer of care that doesn't have the come to all my core team meetings, but is also getting another level of, of, intentionality. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. And I wonder, I mean not to make this too like rigid and high structure, but I wonder to what extent you just know that part of your core team. Is someone who's committed to informing your advocates or kinda keeping your advocates in the loop? You know, I mean, I think that, ~again, we don't wanna make this overly rigid or, you know, like make you feel like you're running a small business, but ~in some ways to, to steward all of the people and churches that might be joining with you in this task.

It, it can just be really helpful to have identified. Streams of, of good communication and clarity. ~You know,~ 

Andy Brennan: I really like that actually, ~um, ~that having an advocate manager, if you get to that point where you need that. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. 

Andy Brennan: Yeah. ~That's great.~ 

Heather Winchell: What about when, okay, so ~let's, ~let's say you've had an experience with your home church.

You've, [00:16:00] you've identified some advocates you're working with. Those people in their churches. What about when you're approaching a church and you don't have any connections? You know, in the module we talk about how a cold approach is the least effective. ~Yeah. So ~if someone feels led to approach a church that they have no ties to, what steps should they take to to really set themself up well for a positive response?

Andy Brennan: I've never done this. So, Corey, ~I'm, ~I'm curious. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. So in my experience, ~um, ~small churches are more likely to be, ~um, ~good places to start because ~es ~especially, you know, I've talked before in some other podcasts about coming from a rural area. ~Yeah, and, ~and those are small churches and a lot of those do not have a lot of missionary partners.

And a lot of them are just like so interested to [00:17:00] hear about anyone who is doing anything outside of their community because ~it's so, it, ~it feels novel for them in a way. And like ~they, ~they want to get on board with supporting something. ~Um. ~Overseas. And so, ~um, ~you know, those are also easier to connect with leadership because there's usually only one or two people in leadership, ~um, ~in terms of the pastoral staff.

~Um, and you know, they're also, uh, more. Uh, ~they, it's easier to find advocates within those churches. Even if you don't have connections, ~you can quickly, in my experience, ~you can quickly find the people who are excited to get on board. ~Um, ~I think that larger churches would be more challenging because, ~you know, they, ~they draw more attention from people who make missions funding requests.

They're kind of oversaturated. ~Um, ~we have a lot of specific parameters already in place and filters to filter financial requests. ~Um, ~I wouldn't necessarily rule them out completely, ~um, ~but just go directly to the missions committee or missions pastor, ~um, with the church, they're not connected to. ~But I think if you're gonna start from [00:18:00] scratch ~first, ~the first thing to do would be to show up at some type of event.

~Um, ~and just make that first impression to introduce yourself ~to, ~to find the pastor and then, ~um, you know, ~give them your ~short, ~very short elevator pitch and ask for a meeting. ~Mm-hmm. ~I always try to get that meeting. And find out who, who are the people that you need to be meeting with. ~Um, ~and then once you get that meeting, then it's a little bit easier ~to, ~to explain more about who you are, what you do.

~Um, ~and yeah, ~that's, ~that's how I would try to get the foot in the door. 

Andy Brennan: ~I, ~I wonder too, ~um. ~Different denominations have different expectations and different, ~um, kinda ~standards. ~Um, ~they do, yes. Right. So ~some, ~some denominations, it feels like, and ~this is, ~this is the minority, but I have worked with somewhere, they actually expect you to go from church to church to church in the denomination.

Corrie Mckee: Right. 

Andy Brennan: And you know, nobody in those churches. ~Right. ~But those, those groups are used to people coming in and saying, I, I'm in this church, I'm in the network and I'm gonna tell you about this mission that I'm going on. So that's an important [00:19:00] thing just to think through as well on the front end deputation 

Corrie Mckee: thing.

Andy Brennan: Mm-hmm. ~Yeah.~ 

Corrie Mckee: Call that deputation and, yeah, I've, I have coached some missionaries who are in a denomination like that, and they, they do it, they go from church to church, and it works for them because they're within a denomination that supports them. I, I would not counsel anyone to spend a lot of their time doing this at random churches, you know?

Spend, you know? Right. Make this your main gig, you know? 

Andy Brennan: Right. I wondered Corey, too, as we, as you were talking, I just kind of thought, what if, what if you just, if you had a long-term perspective, like I'm gonna be on the field for like five years, you go to these people and say, my first ask is, I would just like to get in front of your congregation and ask for prayer.

I'd like ~to, ~to update you. I'd like to keep you. In the know ~and, ~and just to partner with you on this level. And then if you like this ministry and you feel like this is like your congregation is fed by this next year, I'll talk to you [00:20:00] about financial partnership 

Corrie Mckee: a hundred percent. ~That has worked for me before.~

Andy Brennan: Nice. 

Corrie Mckee: Yep. Yep. So I would definitely recommend that for anyone who's thinking long term, ~um, ~especially if you already have your home, church, and others supporting you, ~but. To, ~to get the prayer support first and to get that acknowledgement from the congregation that they knew who you are. I had this one small church of about 200 people and, ~um, they, ~they allowed me ~to, ~to come and share and then send my newsletters and they had a bulletin, a missionary bulletin board, and they posted my newsletters on there and it was about one or two years in.

I was on the field for nine years, ~but. ~It took one or two years ~and, ~and they said, we have never had a missionary that communicates with us ~like so, ~like so often. And so well, ~and, ~and we want, ~um, we, ~we love to have your newsletters and we wanna put 'em up on our bulletin board. And so, ~um, ~we'd like to start supporting you now financially.

Andy Brennan: That's awesome. ~So~ 

Corrie Mckee: that, just having that ~communicate the regular communication~ 

Heather Winchell: is super important. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And [00:21:00] what's. No good. And I love, what I love about that is that it's not just, you know, there's, I don't know. I feel like there's a way we could talk about this where people are understanding like, oh, okay, if I just cultivate this relationship long enough, like it will bear fruit for me.

But actually what's happening is the. That congregation over time is becoming more drawn to what God is doing, and you just happen to be part of that. And because they're more drawn to what God is doing, they, they're investing more and more of themselves in that. And so again, it's the mutual formation, the mutual provision, you know.

~Um, ~community and financial provision for you and provision for them of being given opportunity to see what God is up to in other parts of the world. And so, yeah, I just really love that. I love that unfolding relationship and how it continues because God is doing real things and, ~and bringing. ~Bringing good, you [00:22:00] know?

Mm-hmm. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. I think that's so true, Heather, because there are, it's just like fundraising from individuals or families. There are people out there who are looking for an opportunity to give their resources and to, like, they're really wanting to see what God is doing around the world, and there are churches like that.

Who are, who are wanting to know what is God doing? Can God bring us someone who will share with us firsthand what they see God doing? And that's a huge way that we can bless those churches too. Mm-hmm. 

Andy Brennan: Well, and I love that the focus is not on who can give me the most money and how can I collect this?

~It's, ~it's these churches ~and, ~and your examples, Corey, they aren't mobilized. They aren't thinking outside of their little community. So if you're tempted to think, well, I feel like I'm just ~kind of. Some ~kind of a salesman or I'm some kind of a traveling charlatan going in ~and, ~and sweeping up money. Like that's not what it's about.

~Um, ~as you're talking Heather, I was thinking about Donald Miller's story branding ~and so in ~in marketing speak, [00:23:00] he would call this ~like ~a transitional ask. ~So be like, like ~all kinds of companies do this, right? ~Like ~you go to a website and it's like, here's my service. But if you're not interested in buying quite yet, like sign up, gimme your email address and I'll send you this free PDF ~or, ~or whatever it is, this is kind of the same thing.

And if you're tempted to feel like, well, I don't, I don't want to feel like a marketer, I just wanna be a missionary. ~Well, ~but at the end of the day, your end goal is to mobilize these people and to get them into the great commission. ~Why not? ~Why not use those kind of psychological or just kind of human nature tendencies to do that?

Heather Winchell: ~Hmm. Yeah. ~You don't have to exploit them in order to leverage them. 

Andy Brennan: Yeah. It's not exploitation if, ~if it is ~it's gospel exploitation, which is kind of an oxymoron, 

Corrie Mckee: I would call it exploration. 

Andy Brennan: Mm, ~much ~better 

Corrie Mckee: because you are exploring. A partnership. Partnership. And they're exploring, wanting to know what's going on in the world that they're not gonna hear when they turn the news on.

For sure. [00:24:00] What's the big stuff that God is doing, you know? So they're exploring too. 

Andy Brennan: Yeah, that's a great point. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. I know this might kind of be going back a little bit in our conversation, but something that came to mind if you don't have connections, just some ways to, ~to kinda ~become more aware of other churches and what their heartbeat is.

So in our community, ~we, ~there's actually like a coalition of pastors from all different denominations that ~they ~meet regularly and ~they ~have like a really rich prayer together and just kind of. ~Um, ~pulse on what is happening in our city. And so, you know, because our pastor is part of that, our pastor could be a really meaningful connection to other churches that would be part of that as well.

So people could explore whether their, ~you know, ~city or their community has. A coalition kind of like that, or, ~you know, ~there are a lot of, ~not denominations, but ~networks of churches these days. And those networks often have a shared [00:25:00] interest in specific things, right?

Like some networks are built around church planting, some networks are built around a denomination, ~you know, ~whatever it might be. But that could also be a really healthy stream to wade into to see, ~you know, ~who within that network could be a potential church to approach. 

Andy Brennan: That's a great point. So for example, you could walk into another Acts 29 church and say, Hey, I attend this Acts 29 church in this city. And I talked to my pastor and he said, I might wanna talk to you guys. 

Heather Winchell: Mm-hmm. 

Andy Brennan: That's a good foot in the door too.

~Yeah.~

Heather Winchell: So I feel like we've, we've had some really good conversation around finding advocates, finding churches, approaching churches. I think another really important piece of this ~is understanding whether, ~is determining whether there's alignment between what that church is about and what you are doing, because you're not just looking for money wherever it is to be found.

~I, I really do. ~You really are looking for partnership and alignment and [00:26:00] so let's talk about that. ~Yes. So you you can, oh, ~

Corrie Mckee: Okay. So you can save yourself a lot of time and grief if you start here. ~And ~I did put it towards the end of the curriculum, ~um, ~because it's a follow up.

But when you're actually taking the action to go out and connect with churches, I would start here. This is getting to know the church questions, to ask yourself questions, to maybe do some research on their website before you even talk to anybody. ~Um, ~you wanna know if they're going to be ~a, ~a like-minded partner with you.

~Um, ~what ~is, ~are the priorities ~of, ~of the church? ~And so, um. ~Just some questions to think about. Do they align with your theological views and the theological views of your organization? ~Um, ~would you be comfortable receiving support from them? Would they be comfortable receiving your updates about your mission, the way that you go about doing your [00:27:00] mission, ~um, ~the conversions that are happening, ~um, ~the outreach, et cetera.

~Um. So, you know, ~different organizations have their different styles of doing those things, doing ministry, and some churches may not be a good fit to partner. So that's just a place to start. 

Andy Brennan: So you've learned the hard way 

Corrie Mckee: Me, 

Andy Brennan: is that what you're saying? Yeah.

~Uh. ~Do we have any examples ~of, ~of this ~not, ~not working well? Like is there a cautionary tale amongst us where we could say, I didn't actually prepare, or I didn't really know what I was getting myself into. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah, I wanna speak with a lot of generosity of heart, but also give some specifics, but I, I think, I'm just aware that sometimes there can be a disconnect between some expectations that a church has.

For example, I know that, you know, some churches feel very strongly about particular translations and so it's important to them that those that they support. Use those translations [00:28:00] in the work that they do. But you know, we've all worked with cross-cultural students, with people that don't speak English as their first language.

And so, I mean, honestly, we speak English as our first language, and the King James Bible is kind of hard for the modern English speaker. Right. So that would be an example of a situation that would be difficult to navigate because. It's just not aligned with what you know to be helpful in your context.

Or another consideration, which I think can feel difficult to navigate is that sometimes what it looks like for a church or even an individual to partner with you has a strong emphasis on ~like. ~The return on investment or kind of numbers like, how many people were baptized, how many people made a decision.

Mm-hmm. And ~I, ~I think there's so much nuance to that and what's behind that. And that can also be very difficult to navigate when you're actually in more of a relational ministry [00:29:00] where it's just a lot of removing rocks, a lot of faithfully showing up every day, which honestly we all know is. A lot of what it looks like to share.

The hope that we have is just a preparing and a doing the right thing and not necessarily seeing the results. So those are a couple of things I could think of. 

Andy Brennan: And in this context, removing rocks is, the sewing and reaping metaphor. So sometimes you don't even have the ability to plant or water or reap, you're just literally clearing the field.

Heather Winchell: Right. ~Right. Yeah,~ 

Andy Brennan: I think that's great. And it's not a one size fits all. Approach. It's, and that's okay that your particular ministry calling and niche doesn't fit generally. A lot of times we are called to specific things and PE churches have different focuses, and that's great. It's all a gospel movement.

It's all a solution to the great commission and that's okay. 

Corrie Mckee: Right. True. I also wanted to bring up some other types of [00:30:00] expectations that would be more of administrative things that you would need to consider as a missionary. Like, do I have the time to actually do this, to partner with this church?

And so an example of that would be. An application process for support. Some churches have a pretty long process, pretty lengthy, pages you have to fill out, and multiple meetings with committees that you have to go through. Some churches require extra training, ~um, ~and Classworks, for example.

Having a certificate from the Perspectives on the World Christian Movement course or something like that, that's a 15 week course, you know, so you may not have the time to do that. Some classes or some churches will expect you to, maybe attend their missions conference annually or to host a mission team from their church in your context.

~So ~if you're overseas, they will want to. Send a [00:31:00] group and have a project to do. ~Mm-hmm. ~In their mind, that's what partnership looks like, which could be a really good thing ~if, ~if you have capacity to host them. So you really wanna, as you're going through the process of the initial conversations with the church or with an advocate, you want to have these questions in mind ~of, ~of what will the church expect?

Andy Brennan: I also had a teammate who had an annual commitment to her congregation, to her church to file ~a, ~a certain amount of paperwork, a report. And it was quite lengthy and she was happy to do it because they were very generous. But that's also not out of the question. 

Corrie Mckee: Right. So you gotta figure out those things that, that you may not know upfront.

You could even talk to some other missionaries who are supported by that church and ask them, Hey, what's your experience in partnering with this church? What are some of the, the expectations that they, they have of [00:32:00] you?

Andy Brennan: Great idea.

Heather Winchell: So if we wanted to put some skin on this, make it really practical and actionable, what would you guys say are some habits or like a mindset that people could take on or implement as they move forward to put this into practice?


And I asked the question, but I have an immediate thought that I'm just going to submit. Mm-hmm. And I would just say, you know, best practice is always preceded by prayer and seeking the spirit. And so even though you're being equipped to hopefully reach out to churches, you do know, churches you don't know, find advocates.

Really, we can rely on the spirit to draw us to the people he wants to. And so don't neglect to seek the Lord in prayer about what you should do, which is maybe so obvious that it doesn't need to be stated. But we also know that it can be the one of the first things to [00:33:00] go. 

Andy Brennan: ~I, I, I don't, ~I don't think so, Heather.

I think we can't ever de-emphasize or overemphasize prayer enough, and I think especially when we get into these. Types ~of, ~of objectives ~and, ~and things that we're trying to accomplish. It can be very natural just to try to get it done. Yeah. Especially if you're a high achiever and you're very responsible normally, like we've talked about ~that with, ~with Ms.

Patty. ~Uh, ~that is just, ~yeah. That's ~the reality for some of us. And I think in your prayer also surrendering ~the, ~the outcome. Like asking for blessing. Asking for success, but also saying, Lord, ~like if, ~if it's not meant to be ~like, I, ~I give that to you. ~Mm-hmm. ~And ~I'll, ~I'll keep doing it until you lead me to the right people.

Heather Winchell: Right. And you know, like in season three when we spoke with Callie Davis, having a mindset that can celebrate the no, because you understand that in that no God is doing something else for them and for you. 

Andy Brennan: Yes. I love that. And just recently we were talking to Bernie as well in the podcast, in season four. Right. And he [00:34:00] was saying that no can also be a gospel answer. Yeah, that's great. You have to be able to release that and realize that it is not failure, not your personal failure if somebody says no to you.

And that's different than a lot of lines of work that you go into and a lot of objectives and a lot of jobs. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah, I can second that what you've said, Andy, about the responsibility, get it done, task oriented mindset, because that's me, like I am. My strengths finder is like discipline, responsibility, you know?

Andy Brennan: So I'm, 

Corrie Mckee: I'm executive. 

Andy Brennan: Good soldier. 

Corrie Mckee: That's right. Yeah. And I can just think of some examples of going into churches and trying to make connections with leaders and it just didn't pan out for me and I just. Beat myself up over it, you know, and I wish I would've had a fundraising coach to talk me through this curriculum.

Just to realize, you know, God is in all of this and he's teaching us so [00:35:00] much through, the meetings that don't happen and through the things that fall through. But the prayer thing is so important, just bathing it all in prayer, surrendering it to God and just saying, God, you connect me with the people that you want me to be connected with.

And you know, if it works out, I trust you. If it doesn't work out, I trust you. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. 

Andy Brennan: And I think the other thing just to keep in mind is from a mindset perspective, as Christians we're encouraged to so broadly, so why would we think that doesn't apply to our fundraising?

Like how do we know who the Lord is already calling it, working on behind the scenes and in their hearts? And if we don't give them a chance to say yes. Well, we've missed the opportunity. So I think you have to just cast the net wide. Yes. And sometimes you've worked and worked and worked, and then Jesus says, well, why don't you cast the net on the other side?

Heather Winchell: Mm. 

Andy Brennan: [00:36:00] So maybe he is asking you to do that too. Especially if you're listening to this episode or in this module and you've been on the field for a while. Maybe the Lord's asking you to try something different. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. That's so good. I think that leads us to humble confidence too, because it's humble because we don't know where the support is gonna come from in the end, and so we have to have open hands and trust God for it.

But it's also confident in the fact that God asked us to so broadly to cast our net generously to give people an opportunity to take part in the Great commission so we can be confident that this is our work is of God. And so it's, it's that humble confidence. 

Andy Brennan: Just drilling it into your head, this is not about me.

Corrie Mckee: Yes. So important.

Heather Winchell: Andy said it's not about me and I think what that makes me think is, man, there, there's this real sense in which, you know, as Bernie said, you are the asset. You have to protect [00:37:00] your, like, mind and heart, like self care.

Is actually a really important thing, but holding self care wrongly can just totally destroy what you're trying to do. And what I was thinking was like as a mom. Self-care is really important, but if the emphasis becomes me and my self-care, then it actually all falls apart. And so when you say that, Andy, it's not about you.

It's like, yeah, 100%. It's not about you. And that doesn't mean that you shouldn't be really aware of caring for yourself and aware of your needs and very proactive with your needs. But if that's what consumes you, if that's what the emphasis becomes, then it actually will all fall apart.

Andy Brennan: That's good. I mean, anything can be taken to the extreme and so moderation. It seems like the middle road, it seems to be healthy way. 

Heather Winchell: Well, and it's just so interesting that so many of the important things in the Christian life. It's like [00:38:00] you actually have to put a lot of intention and hard work into that thing.

But if that thing becomes the main thing, then it's not good. That applies to parenting, that applies to your ministry. That applies to, like I said, self-care. I mean, we're meant to approach things with a lot of intention and, strategy and. We're meant to work hard towards things without making those things the ultimate thing 

Andy Brennan: we can idolize

anything. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah. 

Andy Brennan: Even really good things.

Corrie Mckee: True. We can idolize having a specific church on our support list. 

Heather Winchell: Or 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah. If I can just get this name and then I can drop this name and tell other people, then other people will get on board. No, that's not where we're putting our hope and confidence in, 

Andy Brennan: you know? 

Heather Winchell: Right, ~right.~

~Yeah.~ 

Andy Brennan: Good. [00:39:00] 

Heather Winchell: Okay, so as we kind of wrap up this episode of the series, what encouragement would you guys want to leave our listeners with?

Corrie Mckee: Humble confidence is what I, what was my key takeaway. Mm-hmm. 

Heather Winchell: Yeah, I would agree. Humble confidence seems like a good phrase to keep in mind. 

Corrie Mckee: Yeah,

Heather Winchell: all right. Well, as we close out this conversation of the module, we hope that you, as the listener, have found it beneficial. Thanks for joining me today, guys, and we'll be back again to talk about another element of partnering with churches.

Andy Brennan: Looking forward to it. 

Heather Winchell: Appreciate 

it.